15:07:40 <itchka_> #startmeeting
15:07:40 <chwido> Meeting started Wed May 20 15:07:40 2015 UTC.  The chair is itchka_. Information about MeetBot at https://wiki.openmandriva.org/om/en/MeetBot.
15:07:40 <chwido> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.
15:08:15 <itchka_> agenda is here https://project.openmandriva.org/news/17-tc-council-meeting and here http://pastie.org/10198822
15:08:36 <klebedeff_> ashledombos__: avokhmin ben79 bero blackcrack crisb_w franciscopk JLP Kvok_ n3npq nicco_ pcpa Pulfer Xu_R
15:09:05 <franciscopk> hey :)
15:09:07 <klebedeff_> thanks for pastie itchka_ :)
15:09:19 <klebedeff_> hi Francisco:)
15:10:08 <avokhmin> crisb_w: so, the problem that we have 1 queue for all arches. And you have 2 tasks for ARM at the beginning of queue
15:10:33 <klebedeff_> itchka_: I guess for release report we need bero or TPG
15:10:52 <itchka_> We will move that down the order
15:10:54 <klebedeff_> they confirmed presence, so I hope they are around soon
15:11:00 <avokhmin> itchka_: ARM nodes works good?
15:11:02 <klebedeff_> ah, right:)
15:11:20 <avokhmin> klebedeff_: I'm here)
15:11:28 <ben79> here
15:11:43 <klebedeff_> I see av:)
15:11:45 <klebedeff_> avokhmin:
15:12:13 <crisb_w> avokhmin_: ah ok, so if i cancel any arm builds?
15:12:52 <itchka_> avokhmin: Have not had time to try much ARM today but it was working yesterday. Maybe mail fedya?
15:12:56 <blackcrack> here
15:13:06 <avokhmin> crisb_w: try
15:13:28 <klebedeff_> fedya is on holiday I think. I am not sure he is in touch from Greece;)
15:13:30 <avokhmin> itchka_: fedya in vacation....
15:13:41 <avokhmin> itchka_: if read FB :)
15:14:06 <itchka_> Could be his nodes are down for some reason.
15:14:40 <itchka_> If he is not there to bring them up again then they are lost until he returns.
15:15:47 <crisb_w> avokhmin_: no good, everything is stuck in 'Build is cancelling'
15:19:24 <itchka_> Ok I'm going to start the agenda at Item 2.1 as neither _TPG or bero are here yet
15:20:10 <itchka_> #item 2.1 Gaming a: Tutorial Status
15:20:41 <itchka_> franciscopk: I Thinks this is your item.
15:20:41 <franciscopk> games.openmandriva.org
15:20:55 <itchka_> On my way there
15:20:56 <franciscopk> https://games.openmandriva.org/
15:21:04 <franciscopk> layout almost finished
15:21:18 <franciscopk> two pages to do to link with oma community
15:21:34 <franciscopk> but already published 7 tutorials
15:21:59 <franciscopk> and I have to install three more instances to french, portuguese and spanish languages
15:22:26 <itchka_> Wow (and I don't mean World of Warcraft!!
15:22:45 <franciscopk> good idea for wow, I forgot that
15:22:58 <franciscopk> I will try today publish WoW in linux
15:23:18 <itchka_> I meant it as an exclamation!:) Great work Francisco
15:23:57 <klebedeff_> *klebedeff is trying to access:)
15:24:00 <franciscopk> What is pending:
15:24:12 <franciscopk> - three instances for french, spanish and portuguese languages
15:24:27 <franciscopk> - two pages (one to download openmandriva and other about community)
15:24:49 <itchka_> Is tapwag and his team helping with translations?
15:25:07 <franciscopk> - decide with Cristina what we will put beside of OpenMandriva Games logo
15:25:41 <franciscopk> No, but I not asked for any kind o help
15:25:57 <franciscopk> and because I have to install another instance for that language
15:27:19 <itchka_> Well don't forget to ask them when you get to the translations.
15:27:59 <franciscopk> oh, I already configured piwik in openmandriva games and in my google analytics account (only to compare statistics between these solutions) since the site launched.
15:28:26 <franciscopk> and when I have all the credentials ready I will put in BBW
15:29:02 <franciscopk> but the information is already organized in document shared with Cristina
15:29:04 <avokhmin> crisb_w: I clean your queue, can you try to create all builds again (without ARM)
15:29:59 <franciscopk> so the status is that. probably next week I will share statistics about openmandriva english version
15:31:06 <itchka_> francicopk: Do you think we could vary the words in the messages slightly? To have them all the same does not quite work. I am happy to help you with this.
15:31:27 <crisb_w> avokhmin: looks better thanks, how come all the builds are still in build is cancelling?
15:32:12 <franciscopk> what I can say for now is without any kind of publicity, only from crowlers, we already have 32 uniq sessions with 3min04sec session average with only 46.88% rejection %
15:32:51 <franciscopk> itchka_: sure. I already observed that. Do you have an email to share the credentials document?
15:33:52 <itchka_> franciscopk: See private tab
15:34:22 <avokhmin> crisb_w: they will be removed tomorrow automatically :)
15:34:23 <franciscopk> itchka_: done the share
15:34:34 <itchka_> Thanks
15:34:44 <klebedeff> *managed to open
15:34:51 <klebedeff> looks indeed very impressive
15:35:52 <crisb_w> avokhmin: so i take if i accidentally start an arm build I will get stuck again? :)
15:36:14 <franciscopk> And, of course, you someone has suggestion to add some game, please send me and I will try
15:36:24 <itchka_> I agree!
15:36:38 <klebedeff> the latter sounds good enough for promotion post?:)
15:36:48 <klebedeff> or we risk getting 100 games names?
15:36:49 <franciscopk> but do not ask for battlefield 4 or hardline and gta 5 :P
15:36:53 <avokhmin> crisb_w: looks like yes( itchka_ can you check that ARM works and if not - write to fedia ?
15:37:37 <itchka_> avokhmin: Sure. I will do this later tonight.
15:37:54 <avokhmin> itchka_: :+1:
15:37:59 <blackcrack> lil question franciscopk , it's able for have an own forum for Games, so an OMLxGameForum (i think me on http://www.simplemachines.org/)
15:38:32 <franciscopk> I do not know if we try to promove now or wait 4 languages instances or/and get at least the 20 most popular games
15:38:39 <itchka_> klebedeff: I think it might be better to do this when the games team has been formed.
15:38:47 <klebedeff> blackcrack: I guess this would be also in discourse
15:39:20 <avokhmin> maybe create FB page for games?
15:39:24 <franciscopk> blackcrack: but I have to install or use some forum that we already have?
15:39:24 <klebedeff> well, promotion would be good to do when current running tasks for page are finished. itchka_
15:39:59 <klebedeff> but we could benefit from hearing out people - which games they would like to see there
15:40:03 <blackcrack> franciscopk: simplemaschines is gpl, speak therewith with itchka_
15:40:12 <franciscopk> blackcrack: ok
15:40:23 <klebedeff> or shall we wait with this question for public until the page is fully ready?
15:40:38 <klebedeff> franciscopk: itchka_
15:40:57 <franciscopk> klebedeff: I agree, we can wait to promote. However this is being done by google
15:41:21 <klebedeff> franciscopk: and asking people which games they want to see there - we also wait till promotion?
15:41:30 <blackcrack> klebedeff: this can go in one.. itchka_ and franciscopk mus easy speak together about it
15:41:37 <blackcrack> err: must
15:42:10 <itchka_> I feel at least English page should be complete. The international pages can be added as links as they are ready.
15:42:51 <franciscopk> klebedeff: maybe promote a question asking "which games you would like to install in linux"
15:43:08 <itchka_> We need to get Maik and his team primed up for this.
15:43:10 <franciscopk> WoW ins one of them
15:43:31 <klebedeff> пщщв швуф franciscopk
15:43:39 <klebedeff> good idea
15:43:39 <blackcrack> *g*
15:43:41 <klebedeff> :))
15:44:11 <klebedeff> #action klebedeff with jofazepa prepare a poll "which games you would like to install in linux"
15:44:31 <blackcrack> we are learning Russisch, that can you belive, if you make further dath klebedeff *lol*
15:44:47 <franciscopk> http://www.statista.com/statistics/251222/most-played-pc-games/
15:45:06 <franciscopk> League of legends, dota 2 and Minecraft are covered
15:45:07 <klebedeff> ohhh, it would take you much more than that:))) blackcrack :) German is easy comparing to Russian....
15:45:27 <itchka_> Also a link to this site should be on the desktop of the new release. Promotion for the site should also appear in oma-welcome
15:45:28 <blackcrack> *lol*
15:46:26 <franciscopk> accordin with steam platform: http://store.steampowered.com/stats/?l=portuguese
15:46:40 <avokhmin> about https://games.openmandriva.org - maybe add all updates into RSS ?
15:46:46 <itchka_> Hi _TPG
15:46:52 <blackcrack> Hi _TPG
15:47:04 <avokhmin> on main mage
15:47:18 <franciscopk> dota 2, team fortress  are corvered. i will do some work with WoW and CS
15:47:23 <_TPG> hi sorry for being late
15:47:24 <franciscopk> covered*
15:47:34 <_TPG> metting is up ?
15:47:44 <franciscopk> _TPG: yes
15:48:01 <franciscopk> we are talking about https://games.openmandriva.org/
15:48:12 <franciscopk> which games we have to add there
15:48:14 <itchka_> _TPG: yes. I am chair at the moment but if you wish to take over then just say.
15:48:30 <franciscopk> and one action to ask people which games they yould like to install in linux
15:48:36 <klebedeff> franciscopk: itchka_  good point about RSS for games page
15:48:47 <_TPG> franciscopk: awesome site \o/
15:49:00 <itchka_> _TPG: Agenda here http://pastie.org/10198822
15:49:13 <franciscopk> we already have rss https://games.openmandriva.org/feed/
15:49:16 <itchka_> We are doing Item 2.1a
15:49:34 <_TPG> itchka_: lead the meeting then
15:49:49 <_TPG> i'll follow this time :p
15:50:03 <itchka_> Ok if you are happy :)
15:50:13 <blackcrack> i am too *g*
15:50:19 <franciscopk> _TPG: say some game that you need for yesterday in linux :P
15:50:27 <_TPG> but please make some room to talk about beta and Plasma and KDE4
15:50:40 <_TPG> franciscopk: cs:go :p
15:50:57 <_TPG> franciscopk: wolfenstein enemy territory
15:51:21 <_TPG> franciscopk: would be nice to get some good old games files and host on our site
15:51:31 <itchka_> _TPG: We will return to Item 1 on agenda as soon as this item is done.
15:52:05 <franciscopk> what kind of old games
15:52:20 <itchka_> _TPG: Item 2.1d will hopefully cause this to happen.
15:52:54 <_TPG> franciscopk: like wolf:et homm3
15:53:31 <_TPG> franciscopk: long time ago there has been released ported to linux games like above
15:53:47 <franciscopk> good
15:53:52 <avokhmin> franciscopk: maybe use twitch for real time strims of games ?
15:54:00 <_TPG> they are non-free but i think nothing is against to host them on games.openmandriva.org
15:54:22 <itchka_> _TPG: I still have some of these lurking in an old archive.
15:55:08 <_TPG> itchka_: i still have homm3 for linux around the place
15:55:23 <_TPG> franciscopk: maybe a collaboration with gog.com ?
15:55:24 <franciscopk> avokhmin:  we can think, but for now i need to concentrate in tutorials and translations
15:55:25 <avokhmin> If someone can do some streams of games on http://www.twitch.tv and || answer to questions about OM and etc.
15:56:14 <_TPG> we definietly need this http://www.gog.com/forum/general/lgogdownloader_gogdownloader_for_linux/page1
15:56:48 <franciscopk> ok, tutorial to use playonlinux (already in the list) and gog
15:57:44 <itchka_> Well there are plenty of ideas to get this off the ground. Shall we review this on a weekly basis and keep a list of actions on teh agenda to make sure that all these good suggestions are not lost and get actioned?
15:57:58 <franciscopk> ok, i already a lot of work for next week
15:58:01 <franciscopk> we can finish
15:58:10 <klebedeff> would be very good! itchka_
15:58:14 <franciscopk> pending:
15:58:14 <franciscopk> playonlinux tutorial
15:58:14 <franciscopk> gog.com linux client tutorial
15:58:14 <franciscopk> cs:go tutorial
15:58:14 <franciscopk> World of Warcraft tutorial
15:58:16 <franciscopk> Wolfenstein enemy territory tutorial (see old versions coded for linux)
15:58:19 <franciscopk> What we will put beside of openmandriva games logo
15:58:22 <franciscopk> one page explaining and linking with oma community
15:58:24 <franciscopk> one page explaining how you can download OM
15:58:39 <franciscopk> tasks to do to next meeting
15:58:46 <klebedeff> sounds like quite a list....:))))
15:59:01 <franciscopk> until next meeting*
15:59:01 <itchka_> Thank you francisco but don't burn yourself out trying to do them all at once :)
15:59:09 <franciscopk> :P
15:59:48 <itchka_> #action Carry forward list of actions on Item 2.1a to the next agenda.
16:00:08 <itchka_> #item1 Release Report
16:00:15 <itchka_> Over to you _TPG
16:00:28 <klebedeff> thanks a lot franciscopk
16:00:34 <franciscopk> klebedeff: =)
16:00:57 <_TPG> itchka_: ?
16:01:08 <itchka_> Release Report
16:01:19 <_TPG> you mean it's time for beta and Plasma and KDE4 talk ?
16:01:29 <itchka_> Indeed it is :)
16:01:32 <_TPG> ok
16:01:48 <_TPG> #topic Status of beta and Plasma and KDE4
16:02:04 <_TPG> Plasma is up and running even with KDE4 packages installed
16:02:24 <_TPG> help is needed in updating kde applications
16:02:25 <itchka_> Nice
16:03:03 <_TPG> second kdelibs build on i586 stucks so only x86_64 is up to date
16:03:06 <crisb_w> we still have the conflict between the new stdc++ abi and clang to deal with, i think we should rebuild gcc to use the old abi for now as the clang fix doesnt seem to be getting anywhere
16:03:34 <itchka_> bero: ?
16:03:45 <_TPG> isn't this addressed for llvm 3.7 ?
16:04:02 <crisb_w> no, no fix is in place yet
16:04:23 <bero> hi, just got back, sorry, had to have my bandage replaced today
16:04:33 <crisb_w> plus we cant wait for it indefinitely, we can always rebuild c++ stuff after the fix is available
16:04:54 <bero> I've filed a bug report with the llvm guys and so far it only got them upset at the gcc guys for introducing changes without discussing them
16:05:37 <itchka_> That doesn't bode well..
16:05:53 <klebedeff> bero hope you are better
16:06:47 <crisb_w> lets go for rebuild of gcc to use c++98 abi then?
16:07:05 <bero> https://llvm.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=23529 <--- this is where the issue is being tracked
16:07:18 <bero> crisb_w: yes, I guess we can do that and switch back once 23529 is fixed
16:07:26 <crisb_w> bero: yeh
16:07:32 <bero> klebedeff: thanks, I'm essentially fine, can walk almost normally
16:08:06 <klebedeff> very good to hear:) bero
16:09:17 <crisb_w> shall we action it then :)
16:09:29 <bero> yes, let's...
16:11:32 <itchka_> #action:Rebuild  gcc to use c++98 abi
16:13:19 <_TPG> anyone willing to help me with packaging kde application 15.04.1 ?
16:13:58 <itchka_> I will _TPG if you can provide me with some pointers
16:14:02 <_TPG> i assume like 50% is done
16:14:02 <bero> _TPG: sure... Are you aware of the scripts that do it more or less automatically btw?
16:14:06 <_TPG> http://download.kde.org/stable/applications/15.04.1/src/
16:14:12 <_TPG> bero: yes
16:14:28 <_TPG> bero: almost all are updated but first things first
16:14:37 <_TPG> akonadi needs to be rebuild
16:14:49 <_TPG> currently it fails to build with new boost
16:15:06 <_TPG> without akonadi i can't build few kde apps
16:15:27 <bero> While on the topic, what does everyone think about updating stuff that still uses kde4 to git snapshots that use 5? Manjaro seems to be doing it and it seems to work well for them
16:15:28 <_TPG> like whole kdepim
16:15:37 * bero will take a look at akonadi
16:15:49 <_TPG> bero: i'd suggest first to update to 15.04.1
16:16:00 <_TPG> and package software which is missing
16:16:04 <ben79> I'm willing to talk about packaging kde application 15.04.1 if someone is willing to show/teach me how to. Talk about after meeting perhaps?
16:16:11 <_TPG> then we may go to git snapshots
16:17:01 <crisb_w> _TPG: i think akonadi issue is due to the gcc abi
16:17:14 <crisb_w> _TPG: will go away once boost is rebuilt with old abi
16:17:22 <_TPG> kdelibs does not want to build on 1586
16:17:24 <_TPG> i586
16:17:49 <_TPG> crisb_w: so first rebuild gcc then boost and akonadi should be fine :)
16:18:25 <itchka_> Sounds like the gcc build needs to be set going asap.
16:20:05 <crisb_w> right gtg
16:20:06 <crisb_w> bbl
16:20:30 <itchka_> _TPG: Wayland, Hawaii?
16:24:01 <_TPG> Hawaii is somewhat working
16:24:21 <_TPG> i need to patch qtwayland to get new hawaii on board
16:24:52 <itchka_> Do you think we might have something for the beta release?
16:26:16 <_TPG> itchka_: sure but first plfiorini needs to finish wayland session support in his sddm
16:27:06 <itchka_> _TPG: Still some way to go then but it sounds hopeful.
16:27:54 <itchka_> Do you have a date visualised for a QA beta?
16:29:17 <_TPG> according to this https://project.openmandriva.org/projects/cooker/timelines/4
16:29:30 <_TPG> we may not be read with beta on 2015-06-04
16:29:43 <_TPG> for 99% this will be delayed
16:31:27 <bero> yes, better to delay than to release crap...
16:32:06 <blackcrack> +1
16:32:07 <itchka_> Absolutely QA wouldn't let you do it anyway :)
16:32:50 <itchka_> _TPG: Shall we revise the plan to a more realistic date?
16:35:06 <itchka_> _TPG: We still have some fairly major issues with calamares with regard to the bootloader installation. Let alone thinking about any form of secure boot support.
16:35:29 <_TPG> itchka_: imho beta should be released after hollidays
16:35:33 <_TPG> some august
16:36:34 <bero> yes, by that time we should also have had enough time to get KDE5 integration right
16:36:36 <blackcrack> befor 3 meetings, ask i am, if the time well for it.. *smile*
16:38:08 <itchka_> That sounds sensible to me. The last week of August would give the longest time to get issues sorted.
16:39:28 <_TPG> good idea would be to get firefox build with qt5
16:39:35 <bero> yes, that would be great
16:40:03 <blackcrack> apropo, FF have now DRM on it, do we have Fenec in the Repository ?
16:40:05 <_TPG> i've tried 38.0 and situation got improved, seems like some headers needs to be added
16:40:16 <bero> so far the firefox qt builds have been highly unstable, but it looks like things got better
16:41:42 <_TPG> bero: can you please take a look on this https://issues.openmandriva.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1195 ?
16:42:14 <bero> _TPG: sure... That seems to be a matter of adding -lGL linkage to ShivaVG
16:44:41 <itchka_> _TPG: bero: Are you happy for me to record an action to move the beta release date to the last week in August
16:45:09 <bero> itchka_: I am
16:46:42 <_TPG> bero: thanks
16:47:02 <_TPG> i'll reschedule beta to the end of august
16:47:48 <itchka_> Ok Thanks guys I'll record the action.
16:48:09 <itchka_> #action Move beta release date to end of August
16:49:28 <itchka_> _TPG: Any more on the upcoming release?
16:50:12 <bero> If we move it to end of August, chances are we want to update to llvm/clang 3.7 -- if we want to do that, chances are we want to have it in before the mass build...
16:50:23 <bero> So are there any objections to updating to a 3.7 snapshot right now?
16:51:52 <itchka_> bero: What are the chances of it introducing additional work/breakage?
16:52:45 <bero> There's a pretty good chance it'll break a few packages, but they'll need fixing sooner or later anyway (and it won't be many, 3.7 snapshots get lots of daily testing)
16:54:06 <itchka_> I guess we have no way of assessing the impact until we do a mass build?
16:54:25 <bero> true, we can't know any details before we try
16:54:34 <bero> but I'm pretty sure the impact will be low
16:54:59 <bero> My guess is between 10 and 70 packages in main
16:55:32 <itchka_> If we do the mass build and the result is seriously bad can we mass build again with the old version?
16:56:27 <itchka_> It's almost like we need a mass-build testing repo so we can check whether we are going to implode or not:)
16:56:46 <_TPG> we still need a mass rebuild for boost and icu update
16:56:59 <_TPG> so updating llvm won't hurt that much
16:58:12 <itchka_> Perhaps then we should hold revising the beta date until we know the answer to the mass build question. Then we can add on extra time if it's needed.
16:59:48 <_TPG> imho what is most important is to get Plasma and kde4 updated
16:59:53 <_TPG> up and running
17:00:16 <_TPG> so our workshop team may start to work on look and feel
17:00:40 <_TPG> updating llvm won't break whole system imho
17:01:44 <itchka_> _TPG: So what order are you suggesting? Fix the kde4 apps then update llvm and then mass build?
17:02:06 <_TPG> itchka_: this should not collide
17:02:21 <_TPG> imho kde is most important here
17:02:41 <_TPG> to get all packages updated, new ones packaged and that's all
17:05:08 <_TPG> plfiorini: hi qtwayland fails with yours patches
17:05:18 <_TPG> hardwareintegration/qwaylandhardwareintegration_p.h:37:67: fatal error: QtWaylandClient/private/qwayland-hardware-integration.h: No such file or directory
17:12:27 <_TPG> anything important for beta ?
17:12:43 <itchka_> _TPG: Ok let's hit kde.
17:13:41 <itchka_> Calamraes installer we need a c++ programmer to help teo- at least to tray and get bootloader installation in some sort of shape.
17:13:59 <itchka_> tray=try
17:15:30 <itchka_> I can see Calamares dictating the critical path of the release and the soon we come to terms with that the better.
17:15:47 <itchka_> soon=sooner
17:15:47 <_TPG> ok
17:16:11 <_TPG> itchka_: is there a bugreport for this on calamares jira ?
17:19:17 <itchka_> There is a bug report relating to the EFI install but now I have used Calamares for some conventional installs I find that the problem is more far reaching than I had first though. There are issues when there are LVM volumes and when there are multiple scsi interfaces. Because there is no form of manual intervention it is not possible to install cooker on some of my boxes.
17:20:26 <_TPG> itchka_: and what calamares needs ? only bootloader  module to allow to configure where bootloader should be stored ?
17:20:29 <itchka_> The whole process requires proper consideraration. I have discussed with teo- and he agrees that a bootloader installation step is probably the best solution.
17:21:52 <_TPG> ok
17:22:19 <_TPG> calamares is on GSoC so we need to push our ideas in calamares jira
17:22:22 <_TPG> :)
17:23:02 <itchka_> Essentially yes that is what is needed. There is one other aspect that requires attention and that is the automatica creation of a bios boot partiton alongside the efi partition on GTP partitioned disks
17:25:12 <itchka_> _TPG: I will push what I can but we do need to be aware of how critical this issue is.. at this time we do not really have a working alternative or any sane workaround to get Calamares to work.
17:27:25 <_TPG> yeah i understand
17:27:40 <itchka_> #action Expand bug report on Calmares Jira to stress that bios installs are also affected by bootloader installation problems.
17:30:11 <itchka_> Have we covered all that we need to about release progress?
17:31:22 <itchka_> Time is rushing on....!
17:32:07 <itchka_> Ok the Release Report item is closing in 23 minutes
17:32:34 <klebedeff_> in 23?..
17:32:47 <itchka_> apols 3 minutes
17:32:51 <klebedeff_> :))
17:35:06 <itchka_> #item 2.1c
17:35:46 <itchka_> #topic special presentation for Epic
17:36:04 <itchka_> This item will be carried over to next weeks meeting
17:36:32 <Kvok_> that was fast
17:37:01 <itchka_> Kvok: Bero has been unwell.
17:37:24 <bero> and the prerequisites aren't quite met yet too
17:37:44 <itchka_> #item 2.1d
17:37:45 <Kvok_> ok, I wasn't that serious :)
17:38:05 <itchka_> #topic Gaming Package
17:38:41 <itchka_> appointment of team responsible for production
17:39:56 <itchka_> This item follows on from francicopk's efforts to produce gaming tutorial page.
17:42:07 <klebedeff_> which prerequisites bero?
17:42:18 <itchka_> The idea here is to have an iso that will provide an OpenMandriva gaming install which comes with the applications necessary to provide fully function gaming environment.
17:42:33 <franciscopk> I think the idea here is to create package to manage and install the most popular games platform
17:43:31 <bero> klebedeff_: working cooker build with KDE5 to base stuff on -- something we're working on anyway
17:43:32 <franciscopk> like epic, steam, playonlinux, gog, Lutris etc
17:43:44 <klebedeff_> i see, thanks bero
17:44:36 <Kvok_> franciscopk: Isn't meta package more practical
17:44:41 <Kvok_> ?
17:44:54 <klebedeff_> #action to carry topic "presentatin for Epic" to next meeting
17:45:16 <itchka_> Indeed that would be part of it to some extent the application to perform this task already exists in working form. oma-welcome performs a similar funtion on the standard installs.
17:45:20 <franciscopk> Kvok_: but we do not have all this platforms in pkg
17:46:26 <_TPG> sorry i gotta go :(
17:46:47 <itchka_> ok see you
17:47:26 <itchka_> franciscopk:  Perhaps the we should record a list of these packages so that we know what needs to be done.
17:48:21 <itchka_> This would make it easier to allocate the tasks and at least make a start on packaging the necessary software.
17:49:17 <franciscopk> ok i will create a list about what we will need to pack. when it is done I have to send for which list?
17:57:02 <klebedeff_> itchka_: when we have a list, where is it best to send it?
17:57:06 <itchka_> Send it to the cooker list with a copy to me and I will make sure that progress is dealt with on the next agenda.
17:57:33 <itchka_> We will review it weekly until it is done.
17:57:47 <franciscopk> ok
17:57:57 <itchka_> Thank you.
17:59:07 <itchka_> #action Francisco to send list of packages required to cooker list and to itchka. Progress will be monitored at weekly meeting.
18:00:05 <itchka_> Kvoc: Would you be happy to team lead this work?
18:00:24 <itchka_> Kvok_: ^^^
18:01:20 <itchka_> I will act as a team member and I'm sure we can recruit a few others.
18:02:07 <Kvok_> Probably yes, but I'm not really sure what would that include
18:02:46 <Kvok_> itchka_: just a little explanation, please
18:02:49 <franciscopk> Kvok_: this taks will support http://games.openmandriva.org tutorials
18:02:56 <franciscopk> tasks*
18:03:12 <franciscopk> providing a easy way to install the most popular games platforms or games
18:04:11 <itchka_> Kvok_: Building a few packages and helping those less expert to build packages too. A good start might be to provide basic templates for the packages that packages can use as a starting point.
18:05:17 <itchka_> Just creating the package repositrories would help things along.  I will work with you on this.
18:06:58 <itchka_> We already have steam packaged so we have a starting point.
18:08:18 <Kvok_> I would love to, but I have no experiences on building packages (quite sad about this fact). But if you're willing to explain, I'm in
18:10:05 <itchka_> Kvok_: Ok you and I will work with franciscopk on this we will soon have a plan and some work to show for it.
18:10:25 <franciscopk> ok
18:10:32 <itchka_> As soon as I have the list we will talk.
18:11:46 <Kvok_> Great, just email me then
18:11:47 <itchka_> packaging is I'm sure soemthing you will have no problem mastering.
18:11:59 <itchka_> Ok
18:12:38 <Kvok_> Will we ba packaging for 2014 or 2015 release?
18:12:45 <Kvok_> *be
18:13:53 <itchka_> Good question. I would feel safer starting with 2014 initially and then moving to 2015 when things are more stable.
18:14:50 <itchka_> We do not want to contend with other broken packages when we are trying to build new ones.
18:15:18 <Kvok_> btw sorry for being less active last weeks, I was preparing for my graduation exam (I've passed fortunately)
18:16:11 <Kvok_> *I'm sorry
18:16:21 <itchka_> #action Kvok_, itchka and franciscopk to meet to finalise list aof application required for gaming package. Congratulations on your achievment :)
18:17:16 <itchka_> whoops I'll have to post edit that :)
18:17:55 <Kvok_> :)
18:18:09 <Kvok_> but thanks :)
18:18:22 <itchka_> Ok does anyone have any more to say on agenda item 2.1 Gaming otherwise I'll close it in 3 minutes.
18:21:11 <itchka_> #item 2.2
18:21:33 <itchka_> #topic Monthly Development Report
18:23:38 <itchka_> Unfortunately bero and _TPG are no longer here and this does require their presence. I think much of what this was intended to cover was actually covered in the release report. I suggest we cary this item forward to next week.
18:23:54 <itchka_> If there are no objections.
18:23:56 <franciscopk> ok
18:25:37 <itchka_> This brings us the last named agenda item.
18:25:52 <itchka_> #item 2.3
18:26:11 <itchka_> #Topic ABF video
18:26:32 <itchka_> avokhmin: The floor is yours...
18:27:52 <avokhmin> https://www.loomio.org/d/s4OAKwS7/learning
18:29:06 <avokhmin> we should wait all suggestions and later - select top 5 most important
18:29:27 <itchka_> avokhmin: That's a pretty wide brief!!
18:29:32 <avokhmin> So, need to understand: what need to record
18:30:48 <klebedeff_> https://pad.openmandriva.org/p/Tutorials_-_what_you_want_to_learn  for non members
18:33:04 <itchka_> I think this reaches far beyond abf and really needs to address the whole packaging process. I recently tried to help someone get going with ABF. The personhad some packaging knowledge and knew how to build software from sourcecode but they were completely baffled by some aspects of ABF.
18:35:18 <itchka_> I would say that the first think that is required is a simple users guide. This should show what you need to do to build a package. It should cover abf setup first things usch as ssh keys are an essential first step.
18:39:34 <avokhmin> can you duplicate last messages about videos, my IRC client crashed...
18:39:54 <itchka_> sure
18:40:16 <itchka_> [19:33] <itchka_> I think this reaches far beyond abf and really needs to address the whole packaging process. I recently tried to help someone get going with ABF. The personhad some packaging knowledge and knew how to build software from sourcecode but they were completely baffled by some aspects of ABF.
18:40:18 <itchka_> [19:35] <itchka_> I would say that the first think that is required is a simple users guide. This should show what you need to do to build a package. It should cover abf setup first things usch as ssh keys are an essential first step.
18:40:29 <itchka_> excuse the typos
18:43:03 <itchka_> I think one tutorial covering the whole of ABF would be too much for anyone the videos need to be delivered in "bite" sized pieces so that each aspect can be understood before the next one is introduced.
18:43:52 <avokhmin> щлб иге црфе ещ кусщкв
18:44:04 <avokhmin> ok, but I should know what need to record
18:44:14 <itchka_> I'll wite some stuff on the Loomio
18:44:21 <avokhmin> :+1:
18:44:52 <avokhmin> itchka_: small topics, for 5 min videos
18:45:47 <itchka_> avokhmin: I will do so. I will consult the person I tried to teach :)
18:46:30 <itchka_> Shall we move to section 'b' of this topic.
18:47:01 <itchka_> bero: Your comments on this would be really welcome.
18:48:15 <avokhmin> itchka_: ok, should I create issue for it on `project.o...` ?
18:49:03 <avokhmin> Or let's wait https://www.loomio.org/d/s4OAKwS7/learning ?
18:49:39 <itchka_> avokhmin: Lets wait until there is "more meat on the bones"
18:49:49 <avokhmin> ok, something else?
18:50:27 <itchka_> #topic Application for write permission. Procedures
18:51:17 <itchka_> This is really for bero to comment on I think
18:54:15 <itchka_> I do not know what levels of permission exist within abf. Clearly there is write permission but is this subdivided into different levels does write permission imply project creation permission for example.
18:55:06 <itchka_> Untill we know how fine grained the permissions are it's hard to know how to create an procedure to apply for them.
18:56:20 <avokhmin> brb, need put to bed son.
18:58:09 <itchka_> Ok Dad
18:58:43 <bero> back, sorry
18:59:09 <bero> IMO we can essentially give everyone write access and just revoke it if someone messes up
18:59:22 <bero> It's not like a bad commit destroys what was there before
18:59:58 <bero> we should probably walk someone through building or updating 1 package before giving write access
19:00:37 <benbullard79> me
19:01:11 <benbullard79> woops! didn't read in context.
19:01:33 <itchka_> That sounds ok to me should be possible to ensure that level of competance especially when avokhmins videaos become available.
19:02:59 <itchka_> One thing I am curious about though bero. What is the situation regarding package creation in cooker and in 2014. Is it possible to add a package to 2014?
19:03:43 <bero> yes
19:03:53 <bero> we usually don't want to do that at least in main
19:04:02 <bero> but technically it's no problem
19:04:55 <OnlyHuman> that is good to know so can install kernel 4 on 2014
19:06:02 <itchka_> So bero I should have no problem creating packages in 2014 contrib.
19:06:08 <bero> right
19:07:08 <itchka_> Hmm perhaps I'm doing something wrong they always seem to get created in itchka_personal.
19:07:31 <crisb> itchka_: you create them, then add them to the repositories you need
19:08:07 <crisb> then you make sure there's a  branch called openmandriva2014.0 in git so that it will allow you to publish
19:08:41 <OnlyHuman> sounds a nightmare to use
19:09:03 <crisb> it's easy
19:09:30 <OnlyHuman> come round here an try on my account and say that
19:09:45 <bero> Also, make sure you add it to contrib and/or main before trying to build it
19:10:05 <bero> That's done here: https://abf.io/platforms/openmandriva2014.0/repositories/contrib
19:10:20 <bero> (also, please make sure anything added to 2014 after the release also gets added to cooker)
19:10:34 <crisb> its probably better to keep not give new packagers permissions to add packages to the repos anyway
19:11:01 <bero> yes, I don't think write access implies ability to add packages to our regular repos
19:11:08 <bero> that has to be done by an admin
19:11:14 <bero> but AFAIK itchka_ is an admin
19:12:12 <crisb> yeah, i wasnt really talkin about old itchka ;)
19:12:35 <OnlyHuman> itchka_:  is not old
19:13:11 <itchka_> :)
19:13:22 <crisb> :)
19:13:50 <OnlyHuman> though may have a bus pass
19:13:58 <itchka_> OnlyHuman: Race you to the shops! :)
19:14:33 <OnlyHuman> itchka_: I would stand no chance against you
19:15:11 <crisb> watch out for the next cuts, you'll lose that pass ;)
19:15:12 <OnlyHuman> unless you were walking an I was in a car
19:15:53 <itchka_> OnlyHuman: I wouldn't bet on it pal... :)
19:15:57 <OnlyHuman> yes they like cutting unless it affects them
19:16:26 <OnlyHuman> I think it would be a safe bet
19:18:10 <OnlyHuman> wonder how safe the beeb is?
19:18:54 <OnlyHuman> if it is scrapped hope get my license fee back
19:19:46 <itchka_> Back to the point. I think we could incoporate the permissions requirement into avokhmins video so that when a certain number of video tutorials have been watched we know that the individual knows how to do the required processes.
19:19:46 <crisb> tv would become absolutely terrible
19:20:10 <OnlyHuman> yes, no Dr Who
19:20:26 <itchka_> OnlyHuman: Don't wind me up. I'm cross enough after the result!!
19:20:41 <OnlyHuman> result?
19:21:12 <itchka_> of the vote who else would want to kill off the beeb
19:22:14 <OnlyHuman> apparently hundreds thousand of voting slips were stolen
19:23:04 <itchka_> OnlyHuman: Let's not go there
19:23:33 <crisb> itchka_: watch some cassetteboy videos on youtube to cheer you up :)
19:23:42 <OnlyHuman> hyaha
19:24:37 <itchka_> crisb: I might have to do that I'm still in a state of agitation over it.
19:25:31 <itchka_> Let's get back to the meeting before I lose the will to live!!!
19:26:09 <avokhmin> back
19:26:42 <crisb> i think these meetings could do with being shorted, 4.5 hours?!
19:26:55 <itchka_> Ok so we need someone to write up some stuff on the wiki regarding write perms on ABF. Any volunteers?
19:30:30 <itchka_> crisb: They will get shorter once things start getting done. This one is already shorter than last weeks by nearly an hour:)
19:31:40 <itchka_> Ok I'll close item 2.3c and bring it up again next week If I haven't found time to do the wiki stuff.
19:32:02 <itchka_> Let's move on
19:32:16 <itchka_> #item 2.4
19:32:34 <itchka_> #topic  Membership in http://openpowerfoundation.org
19:33:31 <crisb> i thought someone was going to put forward a case for this because those who discussed it last time werent massively keen
19:33:59 <itchka_> I was writing similar but you got in first.
19:34:18 <avokhmin> :)
19:34:26 <avokhmin> I suggested it
19:35:30 <avokhmin> someone else know something about it?
19:35:38 <itchka_> What advantages do you see for it avohmin
19:36:09 <itchka_> This is power pc architecture which is quite dated.
19:36:34 <crisb> well its not dated its just quite niche
19:36:43 <OnlyHuman> sounds like their power crazy
19:36:49 <avokhmin> It's new architecture. And if OM forward for all new - we should review it as minimum
19:36:58 <OnlyHuman> exclusive little club
19:37:37 <avokhmin> http://openpowerfoundation.org/membership/levels/ - it can be free for us
19:38:36 <pcpa> avokhmin: it should be trivial to "bootstrap" openmandriva in a fedora chroot
19:39:24 <OnlyHuman> be good if someone could invent an easy to play game like bingo but players contibute coincidently to building pkgs on abf
19:39:28 <avokhmin> Why in fedora chroot ?
19:40:11 <pcpa> avokhmin: you can ask for a free account in powerpc at https://gcc.gnu.org/wiki/CompileFarm
19:41:14 <pcpa> the only powerpc free access I know of, but must be careful with disk usage... gcc CompileFarm got kind poor lately, only non x86 hosts are IBM donated, but "big" powerpc computers
19:41:43 <avokhmin> I suggest it for OM, not for himself, I have not time for it and have no skills. I'm not a package contributor.
19:42:15 <avokhmin> so, my thoughts: it can be interested for OM. Yes - ok, not - no)
19:43:00 <pcpa> avokhmin: newer power has place in big business, but only for servers
19:43:28 <avokhmin> good, we have no server distro
19:43:32 <crisb> i think it will struggle to get off the ground without someone like fedya who can champion it
19:44:44 <OnlyHuman> maybe they could provide free a Cray super computer for abf
19:45:02 <avokhmin> Also, we can invite, but do nothing, and get some access to docs or something else. Maybe it will be interested for someone.
19:45:36 <klebedeff_> so there is no obligation at all? avokhmin
19:45:46 <avokhmin> for someone who don't like Ubuntu :D
19:46:14 <avokhmin> http://openpowerfoundation.org/membership/levels/ - Associate & Academic	 $0
19:46:57 <crisb> it doesnt bother me if we join it
19:47:12 * bero dislikes Ubuntu, but I don't think there's much of a chance the openpower architecture will be successful. I think it'll be a battle between x86 and aarch64
19:47:13 <avokhmin> http://openpowerfoundation.org/membership/current-members/
19:47:47 <bero> My only objection is that we shouldn't be perceived as an org that goes everywhere but does nothing
19:48:06 <bero> and since I don't think we have anyone actually working on it, I doubt we'll get anything off the ground there
19:48:43 <avokhmin> yeah, it reason...
19:48:55 <avokhmin> maybe it will be interested for fedia ?
19:49:18 <itchka_> I think he will be doing aarch64
19:49:25 <avokhmin> or someone who would like to try something new
19:50:10 <avokhmin> ok, looks like we should wait first person who will be interested in it
19:50:23 <avokhmin> and only after - join
19:50:39 <bero> that sounds like a plan
19:50:55 <bero> keep options open, but don't jump into something we can't really follow up on
19:51:13 <avokhmin> yeah
19:51:38 <avokhmin> ok, I have nothing to say about it
19:52:03 <itchka_> At the end of the day we cannot spread ourselves too thinly It is better to be good in a limited area than mediocre over a wide range of endeavours
19:53:22 <itchka_> Ok I'll record that
19:53:27 <itchka_> #action review membership issue periodically
19:53:40 <avokhmin> ok. PS: when we will have a plan about server distro?
19:53:45 <itchka_> Finally we come to
19:53:52 <itchka_> #item 3
19:54:11 <itchka_> #topic Any other business
19:54:26 <OnlyHuman> remastering?
19:54:54 <OnlyHuman> fix broken pkgs
19:54:55 <itchka_> I think we had better deal with the broken mirrors first
19:55:01 <OnlyHuman> ok
19:56:00 <crisb> they're coming back to life now: http://downloads.openmandriva.org/mm/
19:56:05 <itchka_> ben79: Has reported that our mirrors are lagging behind ABF by four days
19:56:40 <crisb> problem was that the primary mirrors were not syncing
19:57:07 <crisb> i mailed abf users but no response, not long after the primary mirrors synced so i guess someone did something :)
19:57:35 <crisb> should all be up to date in the next 12 hours or so
20:00:05 <itchka_> As a subjunct to this I have created a new reporting section in Bugzilla for Infrastructure bugs so far there are three categories. Please see the mail s on the lists. These categories have default assignees who will be mailes if a bug is reported in any of these categories.
20:00:25 <itchka_> Please report issue on Bugzilla in future
20:02:19 <itchka_> I have two items which are linked to bring up One is are we going to create a 2014.2 release and if seo we will need to fix omv-build-iso so that it builds working images for 2014.
20:02:34 <crisb> can we not just use whatever was used for 2014.1?
20:03:49 <itchka_> I am not sure crisb I have never tried to create an iso on abb I have only used the tool locally. I do not think I have permissions to create isos .
20:04:30 <itchka_> If someone can produce a spin Qa will be happy to test it.
20:04:33 <crisb> lets see
20:04:36 <ben79> Many but not all mirrors have updated today.
20:04:38 <crisb> i've just started one
20:04:59 <crisb> ben79: yes the number updating should continue to rise
20:05:20 <ben79> Thanks for your efforts on this.
20:06:43 <itchka_> crisb: In order to streamline things ahould we communicate directly ov the iso build issues. We can then close the meeting.
20:08:25 <itchka_> klebedeff: What should we do about announcement of 2014.2?
20:09:28 <klebedeff_> well, we will do it:) itchka_
20:10:03 <klebedeff_> we just need to know the exact time when everything is ready
20:10:16 <klebedeff_> 2 days before I'd say would be good
20:10:42 <itchka_> I will endeavour to keep you informed as to progress.
20:11:37 <itchka_> #action Prepare 2014.2 spin for QA test
20:11:38 <klebedeff_> thanks:)
20:12:10 <itchka_> Ok folks is there any anyother business?
20:12:51 <itchka_> Meeting will close in 5 minutes
20:14:11 <itchka_> Next meeting Wednesday 27th May 2015 at 15:00 Hours GMT
20:15:54 <itchka_> Link to agenda will be posted on mailing lists along with meeting notification
20:16:03 <itchka_> 2 Minutes to close
20:17:16 <itchka_> Thank you everyone for you help and cooperation. If we get half of what we discussed done then OpenMandriva will be on the way up.
20:17:25 <itchka_> #endmeeting