15:22:59 <itchka> #startmeeting
15:22:59 <chwido> Woof! Let's start the meeting. It's Wed Oct 14 15:22:59 2015 UTC. The chair is itchka. Information about me at https://wiki.openmandriva.org/en/Chwido.
15:22:59 <chwido> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.
15:22:59 <chwido> You should add extra chair(s) just in case, with #chair nick.
15:22:59 <chwido> Have a good meeting, don't bark too much!
15:23:29 <itchka> #chair klebedeff bero
15:23:29 <chwido> Current chairs: bero itchka klebedeff
15:24:08 <itchka> agenda here https://project.openmandriva.org/meetings/35/agenda
15:24:15 <itchka> #item 1
15:24:38 <itchka> #topic Project state report
15:24:52 <itchka> bero: This one I think is yours :)
15:28:08 <bero> So essentially just non-news ;)
15:28:31 <bero> Cooker is looking pretty good, works reliably on all of my boxes
15:28:56 <bero> theres still a few glitches we have to fix, like lock screen not working or a password prompt after login
15:29:03 <bero> but overall things are coming together
15:29:15 <bero> essentially that's all, unless people have questions
15:29:35 <itchka> Do we know whether the installer has been fixed people are only running live as far as I know
15:30:08 <bero> I don't know... I'm on an installed system, but it was installed ages ago and is just urpmi --auto-updated a couple of times a day
15:30:19 <bero> I know it worked a couple of weeks back
15:30:25 <bero> but may still need some tweaking
15:30:43 <itchka> Ok one more. Have you released your fixed up kdepim libs
15:31:00 <bero> no, not finished yet
15:31:28 <itchka> It blocks quite a lot when doing an update.
15:31:42 <ben79> calamares fails every time with 'Can not set user 'foo' full name'.
15:31:57 <ben79> https://issues.openmandriva.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1370
15:32:13 <itchka> ben79: Is that withh the very latest iso?
15:32:49 <ben79> Yes.
15:32:53 <rugyada> itchka:  yes, it's 13132 iso
15:33:01 <itchka> Ok thanks
15:33:36 <crisb_mob> Is drakxtools staying in om3 or not?
15:33:44 <ben79> The last build I know of that will install is # 12442.
15:34:09 <itchka> I manage to install by mounting the install directory on and then doing a chroot.
15:36:14 <itchka> You need to delete all the password lockfiles in /etc and then you can assigned passwords and create user home dirs. Then you can run grub2-install and install the boot loader and get a running system. If you need help doing this talk to me after the meeting.
15:36:43 <itchka> cris_mob: That's the next agenda item.
15:37:11 <itchka> Any more questions for bero ?
15:37:34 <itchka> on this agenda item
15:39:07 <itchka> I'll give it till 40 minutes past the hour and then we will move on
15:41:02 <itchka> #item 3
15:41:29 <itchka> #topic Drop/replace MCC
15:41:59 <itchka> I'm bringing this item forward so that crisb_mob can be here to discuss
15:42:18 <itchka> bero: Will you kick this off please
15:43:01 <bero> So essentially we've decided that MCC used to be great when it was written, but it's showing its age and lack of maintenance (and pretty bad code).
15:43:59 <bero> So the idea is to start removing components that are already obsoleted by other tools
15:44:11 <bero> and start phasing out/replacing other bits
15:44:28 <crisb_mob> IMHO it's too late to do this for om 3
15:44:40 <bero> A particularly bad problem is that some tools that are part of MCC can actually create corrupted config files these days because they were meant for older versions of tools
15:44:45 <bero> we can't have that in a release
15:45:10 <crisb_mob> Better we have a full replacement
15:45:18 <bero> yes, no need to rush it
15:45:27 <bero> this is not something to be done immediately
15:45:58 <crisb_mob> On the other hand things are in a mess because we had pok updating stuff to his repo which is now closed
15:46:30 <crisb_mob> So we have some merged stuff with Mageia and some not (drakconf, rpmdrake)
15:49:10 <itchka> We must certainly sort out utilities that are creating corrupted config files. Can you be more specific as to which utils are doing this?
15:52:19 <itchka> bero: What needs fixing for this release
15:53:24 <bero> essentially, what I'm aware of:
15:53:29 <bero> - packages still failing the mass build
15:53:31 <bero> - lock screen
15:53:47 <bero> - password prompt after login
15:53:54 <bero> - install issues
15:54:36 <itchka> I was thinking more of drakx tools
15:56:28 <bero> I'm the wrong person to ask then... Haven't used them since the 1990s
15:57:37 <itchka> bero: Have there been any thoughts on what language the new tools would be written in?
15:57:46 <crisb_mob> Probably python
15:58:37 <bero> Up to whoever ends up writing them -- I don't think they'll all be the same language (but they should be the same framework so we can pull them together as needed).
15:58:44 <bero> Probably we're talking about some C++ and some python
15:59:14 <crisb_mob> I'm not sure how much of them is unique anyway
15:59:39 <bero> yes, for many things we'll probably just end up deciding to use a tool that exists already
16:00:00 <itchka> crisb_mob: I suppose that depends on how unique we want to make them :)
16:01:35 <itchka> bero: crisb_mob: There's a bit of an identity issue here though the tools have been to some extent part of the Mandrake/Mandriva identity
16:04:11 <itchka> I we replace tools with new ones we should consider putting our "stamp" on them perhaps.
16:04:47 <itchka> When I say new ones I mean existing tools that we would utilise.
16:08:53 <bero> yes, probably
16:10:02 <itchka> It looks to me as if this issue needs to be discussed at the next meeting so at least we will have some facts about which utilities need to have their configuration sorted out for the 2015 release.
16:12:28 <itchka> bero: crisb_mob: Shall I close the subject for now and if TPG makes it here he may know more and I'll re-open it. If not I'll do some checking up and we will discuss again at next weeks meeting. Please indicate if you are happy with this solution.
16:12:44 <bero> +1
16:12:53 <fedya> +
16:14:14 <itchka> crisb_mob: ping
16:14:43 <itchka> looks like crisb is in a tunnel
16:19:11 <crisb_mob> Yes I agree
16:19:23 <crisb_mob> Itchka I don't leave that early ;-)
16:19:41 <itchka> :)
16:19:58 <crisb_mob> I agree about identity there will be even less to make us unique if we just use generic tools
16:20:32 <crisb_mob> Its nice to have a consistent interface to the distro
16:21:14 <crisb_mob> Perhaps if everything was a kcm module you'd get that but then that is really anti any other desktop
16:22:08 <crisb_mob> And it has zero omv identity points
16:23:08 <crisb_mob> I will draw up something on the wiki so we know what we have and what options there are and what state our stuff is in compared to the competition
16:23:42 <itchka> I have had some ideas about this for time time. I believe that the community could design the interface most people could use QT designer. Once there is the graphical bit you clever guys can stitch it all together. Am I mad or could this work.
16:24:15 <fedya> btw my last conclusion
16:24:21 <itchka> cris_mob: That would be really helpful. Thanks :)
16:24:25 <fedya> oma 2014.0 not ready to use with raids
16:25:02 <itchka> fedya: We are just moving to that subject next :)
16:25:14 <itchka> #item 2
16:25:43 <itchka> #topic  Server distribution
16:25:59 <itchka> Who wants to kick this off?
16:26:10 <fedya> i',
16:26:12 <fedya> i'm
16:26:23 <itchka> Off you go fedya :)
16:27:06 <fedya> wait a sec
16:28:55 <fedya> well, as we desided in Krakow, we want to move to own distro on soyoustart.eu servers
16:29:14 <fedya> i'm trying to do it
16:29:27 <fedya> well my conclusion is oma2014.0 100% not ready to use on server
16:29:46 <fedya> RAID1 not unworkable
16:30:07 <fedya> of course raid1 is working but other system is far far away from stable
16:32:24 <itchka> You mean our own abf yes?
16:32:28 <fedya> yes
16:33:07 <itchka> So we need to do some work on a server distribution.
16:33:27 <fedya> we need to do a lot of work
16:34:22 <itchka> It is not just raid1 that is no good?  What else needs doing?
16:36:21 <fedya> itchka: network service, resolvconf service, dbus
16:36:45 <itchka> fedya: ouch!!
16:37:29 <fedya> https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1010572
16:37:31 <fedya> this
16:37:56 <fedya> http://lists.opensuse.org/opensuse/2015-01/msg00774.html
16:38:24 <fedya> looks like cooker more stable than release
16:38:25 <fedya> haha
16:39:17 <crisb_mob> So what are the problems?
16:39:49 <fedya> ah
16:39:57 <fedya> look mail
16:40:01 <fedya> om-council
16:40:06 <fedya> i sent a letter
16:40:14 <fedya> it was first issues
16:40:32 <crisb_mob> I'm not in the cpunxil
16:40:36 <crisb_mob> Council
16:40:46 <itchka> fedya: I'll forward to crisb_mob
16:40:49 <fedya> Well after all i run oma14 on mdraid
16:41:17 <fedya> crisb_mob yesterday i sent for you too
16:41:18 <fedya> Crispin Boylan <cris@beebgames.com>,
16:41:50 <fedya> i run it, but distro14 not ready to be a server
16:42:00 <crisb_mob> I'm using mdraid on 2014 with raid 1 on two disks and raid 0 on 2 ssd
16:42:20 <crisb_mob> Ok not got the mail then
16:42:29 <itchka> crisb_mob: You have mail
16:42:47 <fedya> Well, yesterday i wrote "* I want to make an offer to Tomasz or Crispin, as good engineers, to reproduce this issue on server or in virtual machine to confirm (or not) my findings."
16:42:55 <fedya> crisb_mob ^^
16:43:17 <itchka> _TPG: Hi
16:43:34 <fedya> crisb_mob for unknow reason md0 always detects as md127
16:43:45 <itchka> we are talking about oma 2014 server install that fedya has been working on.
16:43:45 <_TPG> hi
16:44:23 <crisb_mob> Yeah I confirm but I don't think it's an omv thing
16:45:01 <crisb_mob> I'm running lvm on top of mdraid
16:45:22 <fedya> raid1-127, raid0-126
16:45:58 <fedya> if crisb_mob or _TPG want to make server chroot, create raid1 on remote server without kvm, enjoy
16:46:00 <fedya> ;)
16:46:14 <fedya> i tried it 3-4 times
16:46:18 <fedya> without success
16:47:00 <_TPG> fedya: maybe better would be to copy stuff from iso into the chroot ?
16:47:05 <fedya> it would be easier to do with kvm on server, but price for kvm is horrible
16:47:10 <_TPG> rather thatn running urpmi --root
16:47:44 <fedya> _TPG how it help to run raid?
16:48:24 <_TPG> do you have any logs ?
16:48:35 <fedya> now raid working
16:48:38 <fedya> i did it
16:48:45 <_TPG> i do not have any raid here so i can't reproduce
16:50:40 <itchka> fedya: Lets get this clear :) you have succeeded in getting it working but it needs much manual work to do so?
16:50:50 <fedya> _TPG https://gist.github.com/fedya/a5c46dca871d13ccb6ef
16:51:02 <fedya> _TPG something wrong with dbus
16:51:50 <fedya> _TPG https://gist.github.com/fedya/711a4385ddd91d63d554 /lib64/security/pam_gnome_keyring.so in minimal installation
16:52:06 <fedya> bootloader-utils requires gtk+ and other graphical libs
16:52:12 <_TPG> fedya: systemctl enable dbus.socket
16:52:50 <fedya> [root@localhost ~]# systemctl enable dbus.socket
16:52:51 <fedya> The unit files have no [Install] section. They are not meant to be enabled
16:53:03 <_TPG> fedya:  what status says ?
16:54:56 <fedya> _TPG https://gist.github.com/fedya/26d24b3620966d668808
16:58:01 <_TPG> fedya: this dbus is not fatal issue
16:58:14 <_TPG> it's related to userspace dbus
16:58:21 <_TPG> are you able to log in as root ?
16:59:17 <_TPG> according to status only problem is with resolvconf
16:59:25 <fedya> yes
16:59:26 <_TPG> Oct 14 16:53:50 localhost systemd-tmpfiles[439]: readlink(/run/resolvconf/resolv.conf) failed: Invalid argument
16:59:31 <_TPG> you have to recreate it
17:03:58 <itchka> We need a text mode installer for servers
17:04:12 <fedya> indeed
17:05:12 <itchka> Would the old drakx installer do  for the time being?
17:05:18 <_TPG> no
17:05:30 <_TPG> drakx is not CLI
17:06:13 <itchka> wasn't there a test installer option where it reverted to a curses interface?
17:06:23 <_TPG> would be nice if someone started to work on this https://abf.io/openmandriva/omdv-cli-installer/blob/master/TODO#lc-24
17:06:32 <itchka> Perhaps I'm going too far back :)
17:06:39 <fedya> _TPG i suggest you to try install oma on the server
17:08:13 <_TPG> fedya: if i'll have such possibility i'll do that
17:08:51 <itchka> _TPG: I might take you up on that as it's bash :)
17:09:51 <_TPG> i did some research, and found couple of bash installers, and imho that one fits our needs
17:10:19 <fedya> _TPG i sent auth credentials to you
17:10:24 <_TPG> first it has to be ported to perform at least basic setup and installation
17:10:29 <_TPG> fedya: ok
17:13:58 <itchka> _TPG: I'll have a go
17:15:36 <fedya> ithcka i think we need to use standart installer, we just need an option 'Server install'
17:15:50 <fedya> http://howtoit.ru/linux/centos/item/36-ustanovka-centos-6-4-minimal.html look screenshots
17:18:12 <itchka> fedya: This will have to be done over ssh so we would need to make an X connection over ssh. We would have to make sure things were set up to allow that
17:26:46 <_TPG> fedya: see my emai
17:29:21 <itchka> To summarise Item 2  Server distribution
17:29:30 <itchka> We need to:_
17:30:14 <_TPG> write/adapt to our needs CLI installer
17:30:59 <crisb_mob> Back what did I miss
17:31:50 <itchka> 1. Create a text based installer or alternatively create a spin which will include enough tools and libraries to allow the use of draklive-install suitably modified to provide the additional utilities required for server installation.
17:32:52 <_TPG> sed -i -e "s/draklive-install//g"
17:34:00 <_TPG> itchka: plz... you would have to put same effort in creating new CLI installer as adapting drakcrap to support server stuff
17:34:05 <itchka> crisb_mob: see pvt tab
17:34:56 <itchka> _TPG: :) Just reflecting the dialogue of the meeting.....
17:35:13 <_TPG> sure
17:35:46 <itchka> X-forwarding is very messy
17:36:33 <_TPG> and simply copying contents of squashfs to chroot in case of server does not work
17:36:57 <crisb_mob> In what way
17:38:59 <itchka> _TPG: Are you saying it's necessary to install from repos?
17:38:59 <crisb_mob> Itchka I've got no pvt tab?
17:39:07 <_TPG> itchka: no
17:40:10 <_TPG> itchka: draklive-install only copies squashfs, what we really need is a CLI installer that copies squashfs too, but is enough flexible to adapt it ti run additional commands, to setup working environment
17:41:14 <itchka> crisb_mob: Sorry I forgot you were on mobile.
17:42:05 <itchka> _TPG: Ok so we need to do post install stuff in a kind of pe environment ('scuse the Windoze term)
17:42:20 <_TPG> yes
17:42:43 <itchka> Ok I'm ok with that
17:43:31 <crisb_mob> Calamares doesn't/couldn't support text mode then?
17:47:13 <itchka> _TPG: So in summary we run in live mode and create the raid array then we copy the unpacked squashfs to the raid / we then chroot and do further configuration and finally we install the bootloader and reboot into the raid. We also need to be able to detect an existing OMA  raid install and mount and chroot to it for rescue purposes.
17:48:35 <_TPG> crisb_mob: it could do that, but this needs some code refactoring to support CLI
17:48:37 <_TPG> itchka: yes
17:49:38 <crisb_mob> Sounds like it would be handy to avoid doing the same thing in two places if we adapted Calamares?
17:51:22 <_TPG> seems so, also calamares have some qt5 deps, conpared to cli installer
17:53:11 <crisb_mob> Brb running home now
17:53:49 <itchka> _TPG: won't calamares work without X. Somewhere in the vague past I remember somebody mentioning this. I accept there would still be some payload
17:54:32 <_TPG> it wasn't me who mentioned that
17:55:15 <itchka> No it wasn't I think it was in the calamares irc.
17:55:44 <itchka> I have the logs I'll look
17:57:16 <itchka> _TPG: Is the server fedya set up running properly now?
17:59:05 <_TPG> itchka: dunno
18:00:04 <_TPG> i can't connect with ssh even if my key i set up
18:03:41 <fedya> _TPG let me fix it
18:04:09 <fedya> _TPG try right now
18:06:11 <_TPG> fedya: nope
18:09:31 <itchka> Perhaps we should moveto the last item. We can always pick up the server install again if required.
18:09:55 <itchka> and you guys can work on it in the background
18:10:50 <itchka> We will give crisb a little while to get home though.
18:13:23 <_TPG> fedya: looks like it is cunning centos
18:16:10 <fedya> _TPG yes
18:16:33 <fedya> check /etc/sysconfig/network ifcfg-eth0 /etc/mdadm.conf /etc/default/grub
18:16:51 <crisb1> Home now
18:17:21 <itchka> crisb1: Wow that was quick !!!
18:17:53 <crisb1> Only two miles hehe
18:18:17 <itchka> both of them in four minutes what a runner!! :)
18:19:35 <itchka> I have to cook for the hoardes soon so let's deal with the final iem.
18:19:43 <itchka> #item 4
18:20:06 <itchka> #topic  link KDE tool detecting/recording error/exceptions to QA mailing list or Errbit like web site
18:20:40 <itchka> Would anyone like to voluteer to tell me what this is about as I have absolutely no idea
18:21:47 <itchka> Is there a kde crash tool that can send emails?
18:22:03 <_TPG> itchka: yes there is a standard kde crash report tool
18:22:10 <_TPG> drkonqi
18:22:28 <itchka> Gosh I thought that died with kde3
18:22:42 <ashledombos_> me too :p
18:22:50 <_TPG> it turned into kcrash nowadays
18:23:02 <itchka> ah that would explain!!
18:23:36 <itchka> Something like this might seriously spam the list.
18:23:59 <itchka> wouldn't it be better to have a dedicated list for it.
18:24:00 <_TPG> idea was to modify it that way so  each crash and each time user decides to send report that report will also hit QA mailinglist
18:25:49 <crisb1> Could be useful if someone triages them
18:26:47 <itchka> I guess if we could do it on a subscribed basis we could get users to participate in QA test programs. It certainly has the potential to catch the bugs that people tend to ignore because they are minor and they can't be bothered to file a bug report.
18:27:29 <_TPG> bbl
18:27:32 <crisb1> Well only crash bugs
18:27:38 <_TPG> gotta go
18:27:51 <itchka> _TPG: Ok see you later perhaps
18:28:05 <crisb1> Bye tpg
18:30:40 <itchka> I think it could provide useful information even if we can't triage everything it would give some clue as to popular applications that people like to use but which aren't working properly. QA Cannot possible test everything but this would help us target our effort.
18:33:20 <crisb1> Excuses excuses ;-)
18:33:47 <itchka> I know, I know :)
18:34:42 <itchka> I'll start a discussion on the QA ml and see what the QA'ers think as they seem to be backward in coming forward here :).
18:35:06 <fedya> _TPG any chanced that you try it today?
18:35:53 <itchka> fedya: _TPG is gone maybe
18:36:11 <itchka> crisb1: Could you take a look?
18:37:33 <fedya> well
18:37:37 <itchka> #action itchka to start discussion on QA ml regarding KDE crash tool.
18:37:42 <fedya> i'll go to play in world of tanks
18:37:43 <fedya> keke
18:38:01 <itchka> fedya: Have fun :)
18:40:06 <itchka> Ok folks I think the meeting is pretty much done so I'll end it at 45 minutes past the hour. Please raise any subjects you wish to discuss under any other business now.
18:40:17 <itchka> #topic AOB
18:40:49 <crisb> why are abf builds being cancelled?
18:41:38 <itchka> I don't know avokhmin any ideas?
18:41:55 <avokhmin> cancelled - timeout maybe?
18:41:58 <itchka> Have there been many cris?
18:44:01 <ashledombos_> is there a doc somewhere about where to download latest cooker isos, we could provide to public?
18:44:21 <crisb> today yes most of my chromium ones
18:44:28 <crisb> but they had only been going a couple of hours
18:47:40 <itchka> ashledombos_: I don't think we want to do that yet as they are uninstallable.
18:50:20 <ashledombos_> itchka: ah ok bit we alseady have some positive review in our forums though :)
18:50:20 <ashledombos_> already
18:51:34 <itchka> These will be people updating from 2014 I would think or people doing what I did and using a chroot to finish the install.
18:53:46 <itchka> crisb: Have you done some iso builds that work?
18:54:38 <crisb> for cooker?
18:54:42 <itchka> yes
18:54:45 <crisb> no
18:54:54 <crisb> i havent even tried booting a cooker iso
18:56:37 <itchka> Don't bother unless you want to mess with chroots; somethings broken in pam I think password.lock files get left behind so calamares can't set the passwords because they are locked.
18:57:10 <itchka> The lock files are not getting deleted
18:58:47 <itchka> Luca has filed some strace info but I've no idea how to fix the proble.
18:59:39 <itchka> I have to go and cook so I'm closing the meeting. I'll be back later.
18:59:46 <itchka> #endmeeting