15:32:37 <itchka> #startmeeting
15:32:37 <chwido> Woof! Let's start the meeting. It's Wed May 10 15:32:37 2017 UTC. The chair is itchka. Information about me at https://wiki.openmandriva.org/en/Chwido.
15:32:37 <chwido> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.
15:32:37 <chwido> You should add extra chair(s) just in case, with #chair nick.
15:32:37 <chwido> Have a good meeting, don't bark too much!
15:33:23 <itchka> #item 1
15:33:39 <itchka> #topic  Review of progress on Release of OmLx-3.02
15:34:16 <itchka> As you all may have noticed from the cooker list TPG has finished updating kapps.
15:34:55 <bero|3> in the mean time, kapps 17.04.1 has been released and is landing in cooker ;)
15:35:07 <itchka> I tried an update but I couldn't update plasma because of unsatisfied Digikan
15:35:42 <bero|3> new digikam is already building
15:36:00 <itchka> For 3.02?
15:36:40 <itchka> or cooker?
15:39:05 <itchka> I can report that I have successfully built and run an i586 iso. Whatever was broken before is no longer broken it all seems to work in VB anyway.
15:39:21 <bero|3> itchka: digikam is building on 3.02
15:39:32 <itchka> Great :)
15:39:43 <christann> I have installed kapps 17.04.00 here and it appears to be working successfully.
15:40:16 <ben79> To update KApps in Lx 3 you have to use --allow-force for better or worse
15:41:18 <ben79> But it is doable and so far is working OK, needs more thorough testing
15:41:24 <itchka> I didn't really want to do that otherwise later fixes (or continued breakage) would not show up.
15:43:23 <itchka> bero|3: I noticed that TPG also mentioned krita and calligra. Any news on them?
15:43:56 <bero|3> Not from my side, I've been working on cooker bits for the most part (KF 5.34, kapps 17.04.1 and aarch64 updates)
15:44:05 <ben79> I do so in order to test which is time consuming and I don't have enough time
15:44:34 <itchka> Hi cc^mint
15:44:52 <ben79> So I want to test the version of KApps, Plasma, ect that are actually going to ge in 3.02 that needs to be decided and frozen
15:45:14 <ben79> otherwise testing becomes an excersise in chasing ones tail
15:45:46 <ben79> this imperative for QA
15:46:41 <itchka> Yes ben79 I guess kapps 17.04.01 is a bugfix and I suspect there will be some who would want to go with that.
15:47:05 <ben79> OK but do developers see my point?
15:47:25 <ben79> We need to know not *think*
15:48:18 <ben79> I will not go through what we went through with 3.01 again.
15:48:22 <itchka> bero|3: Just to throw some light on this issue where is the best point on the kde release cycle to cherry pick. is it around 17.04.05 ?
15:48:42 <bero|3> ben79: sure see the point
15:49:24 <bero|3> itchka: IMO it's whenever we want to make a release -- 17.04.0 is good, but 17.04.1 is better and 17.04.2 will be better than that and 17.04.3 will be better than that, so if we want to we can keep postponing forever
15:49:52 <bero|3> Given 17.04.1 is already there and 17.04.2 is a month away I'd argue that 17.04.1 is probably the best thing to throw at 3.02
15:52:30 <itchka> Ok perhaps then we could work on some sort of sane rule so we can know where we are. Like if the next release is more than a month away when we are redy to release we use what is available at that time. At least then we would havew some sort of prior knowledge of the testing window.
15:52:35 <ben79> So 3.02 will contain Plasma 5.9.5, KFrameworks 5.33.0, KApps 17.04.1, and Qt 5.8.0?
15:54:45 <bero|3> I'd guess so
15:55:50 <christann> I agree with going with KApps 17.04.01.
15:56:13 <ben79> We need to make it official for Qa testing.
15:56:52 <ben79> IMO Lx 3.01 was NOT well tested and worse we lost testers in the process
15:57:41 <ben79> If anyone can't tell I'm as serious as a heart attack about this.
15:57:47 <itchka> It's TPG we should be asking.
15:58:22 <ben79> Then we'd best be asking ASAP
15:58:37 <itchka> Lets post a question on the cooker ml.
15:59:09 <itchka> There's already a thread for the purpose.
15:59:20 <ben79> Ha! I don't seem to even be getting Cooker ML's better a personal e-mail.
16:00:24 <ben79> To be specific what I'm not willing to do is start testing and then hear "gee, this is new a better let's get this in"
16:00:44 <ben79> a = and
16:01:08 <ben79> That killed QA last time
16:02:07 <itchka> That's fair enough. I think the same.
16:02:53 * ben79 rummaging around, "where did I put the anti-rant pills"
16:04:20 <itchka> There are a few other things on TPG's list the one that we can get on with is the 3.02 wiki page.
16:04:42 <ben79> And be aware we have fewer people testing now than we started with on Lx 3.01.
16:04:42 <itchka> To some extent release notes
16:05:20 <itchka> I know ben79 perhaps we can get some of them back on board for this release.
16:06:16 <christann> An update to krita appeared this morning, so I presume that is finished.
16:06:22 <ben79> I have learned that I can work on Release Notes once they are started. It's basically clone Lx 3.0, 0.01 Release Notes and edit
16:06:28 <itchka> bero|3: How long before the latest kapps is available for Lx3?
16:07:43 <ben79> itchka: QAers talked estensively about this at the time a lot of them felt not listened to, me included, and
16:08:13 <ben79> to get them back will require version freeze of major package groups for testing purposes
16:08:27 <bero|3> itchka: shouldn't take too long, it's building in cooker without problems. Probably tomorrow or Saturday.
16:09:16 <itchka> So we could be looking at a final iso on Sunday then.
16:09:21 <ben79> itchka: If we can get them back, there's some very real bitterness and loss of trust
16:10:13 <itchka> I know ben79 we can only try and put right what was wrong and wait and see.
16:10:16 <ben79> itchka: Another thing is for throrough testing we need enough time, give us some time
16:13:07 <itchka> 5 days?
16:13:38 <christann> How many people will be involved with the testing?
16:14:20 <ben79> itchka: 5 days is good
16:14:26 <itchka> iso's on the Sunday before 17:00 with release the following Friday evening?
16:15:26 <ben79> christann: you, rugyada, itchka, ben79, and a few people on the forum.
16:16:03 <itchka> Efrem Mc'Crimon will also test.
16:16:10 <ben79> christann: Though sometimes the forum folks slow thing down with um, odd, problems
16:16:35 <ben79> Yes Efrem is an execllent tester by the way
16:17:01 <christann> I hope we have enough variety of testing systems. Sounds as if we may we okay.
16:17:22 <ben79> We can only do what we can do
16:17:26 <itchka> I know without his help I would not have been able to get EFI booting working.
16:17:38 <ben79> But should make an effort to bring in more if possible
16:17:52 <christann> I will update my old PC once digikam has been released.
16:18:02 <itchka> Maybe a forum thread ben79?
16:18:41 <ben79> Forum thread is good idea, but I don't want to until some things are decided and made Official
16:19:32 <ben79> So we need TPG to agree on major package versions (not necessarily just KDE either)
16:19:51 <itchka> Ok; I'll try and move things along with TPG
16:20:05 <ben79> blog post would be great if we can still do blogging
16:21:08 <bero|3> Mesa 17.1 final is out, so that's another thing we should update (always better to have a final than a -rc)
16:21:44 <ben79> When Y'all talk about Mesa why is it so important, it isn't installed by default on my computers
16:22:08 <bero|3> yes it is
16:22:14 <bero|3> without it you wouldn't see anything on the screen
16:22:27 <bero|3> but you only have various subpackages of it that aren't called mesa-something
16:22:53 <bero|3> you have e.g. lib64dri-drivers-intel (or -radeon or -nouveau)
16:22:54 <ben79> Then what is it's real name? rpm -qa | grep mesa returns nothing?
16:23:33 <bero|3> Loads of subpackages that don't all have the same name
16:23:50 <bero|3> lib64gl1
16:23:54 <bero|3> lib64dri-drivers-*
16:24:00 <bero|3> lib64agl1
16:24:05 <ben79> lib64dri-drivers-intel-17.0.3-1?
16:24:13 <bero|3> lib64egl1
16:24:16 <bero|3> lib64glapi0
16:24:21 <bero|3> and more
16:24:27 <ben79> OK, I get it Mesa itself isn't there but is in other packages
16:24:32 <bero|3> yes, lib64dri-drivers-intel-17.0.3-1 is also part of mesa
16:24:47 <ben79> I just wondered why mesa wasn't installed?
16:25:06 <bero|3> There is no package called mesa
16:25:23 <bero|3> There are tens of packages with different names that come from the mesa source package
16:25:47 <bero|3> doesn't make sense to have a monolithic mesa package because nobody will need all of it
16:26:02 <ben79> Yes there is mesa-17.0.3  in repos currently
16:26:52 <ben79> That's what has puzzled me
16:27:02 <ben79> but enough about mesa, I got OT
16:28:21 <itchka> How do we feel about last minute updates to individual applications?
16:28:50 <itchka> like maybe chromium or firefox for example.
16:28:57 <ben79> well if it's something like graphics or systemd it's a big nl
16:29:03 <ben79> nl=no
16:29:39 <ben79> chromium and firefox are OK as they can be tested rather quicker and won't break someones system
16:30:10 <ben79> but stuff like graphics and systemd and so on are a no
16:30:40 <itchka> Yes I was excluding anything global if it's not in the applications menu then it can't be updated.
16:32:12 * ben79 I just saw that ancient "Network Center" is in application menu, that can be removed in my opinion
16:33:02 <itchka> ben79: Please advise TPG or crisb
16:33:19 <ben79> OK
16:35:01 <ben79> Here's a question about 3.02 which I thought was decided some time earlier:
16:35:24 <ben79> will we be able to have seperate ISO's for Plasma5 and LXQT?
16:35:46 <bero|3> IMO we should
16:35:49 <ben79> I thought some time back we decided that we would do that?
16:35:51 <itchka> Ok I think from now on we must conduct progress through the cooker list. As soon as new major packages land and you see them please post on cooker ml.
16:37:04 <ben79> After the above conversation I need to say that I appreciate that OM does have very up to date packages overall and
16:37:54 <ben79> that this requires a lot of work by bero|3, TPG, crisb and maybe others they deserve all of our thanks for this
16:38:13 <itchka> I am doing some major cleanups on omdv-build-iso and I need to do some testing on ABF so I'll build such isos and see how they work.
16:41:54 <itchka> Doing this though will potentially increase the testing load.
16:43:12 <ben79> Yes, I'm aware, a LXQT only ISO is a much quicker test than Plasma5 plus basic system stuff would be same, but I've been thinking
16:43:34 <ben79> about this in my testing so far, and I think this is better for our users
16:44:32 <ben79> there are requests for a LXQT only ISO and request for not having LXQT with Plasma5
16:44:33 <bero|3> Yes, one of the main gripes we've seen in e.g. the DistroWatch review was "everything is duplicated because there's a KDE tool and an LXQt tool for everything"
16:44:43 <bero|3> We should really have the separate isos
16:45:18 <ben79> bero|3: yes we have users with same complaint
16:47:03 <bero|3> and with an LXQt only iso we might be able to help people who only have 1 GB RAM or so
16:47:12 <itchka> Ok leave it with me. BTW did people pick up on the fact that i586 is now working?
16:47:40 <ben79> I saw that but haven't looked at it yet myself
16:48:21 <ben79> But great work, I'm sure there will be many who appreciate,
16:49:39 <ben79> Which remind me, can we have a warning on the i586 ISO that if user has x86_64 hardware they need to install x86_64 or keep complaints to themselves
16:50:27 * ben79 maybe someone could word the warning more politely than I would
16:50:41 <itchka> Giorgio hasn't replied but I guess he will soon. I doubt if we have time now but it would be good to get the network install working in Calmares. Efrem did a bit of work on it but I don't know how much progress he made.
16:51:39 <itchka> ben79: Regards warning..I'll try but no guarantees.
16:52:14 <itchka> I have to reboot I'll be back in a few minutes
16:57:13 <ben79> where is i686 ISO?
16:57:56 <itchka> I put it up on Google. Hang on and I'll give you the link.
16:59:04 <itchka> https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B0qGV0eSLYwHU3V5YXIwaEJJSUE/view?usp=sharing
16:59:06 <itchka> md5sum is b8cddd67e63b56abb1f510a6d4ef2170  OpenMandrivaLx.3.02-
16:59:07 <itchka> PLASMA.i586.iso
16:59:46 <itchka> I booted it on VB and it was ok.
17:08:09 <itchka> Ok I think it's time to move on.
17:09:18 <itchka> We can't do item 2 because that's TPG so we will move to item 3
17:09:23 <itchka> #item 3
17:10:01 <itchka> #topic  2. Review of progress of dnf
17:10:14 <ben79> itchka: is the ISO i586 or i686?
17:10:53 <itchka> It reports i686 on booting even though it's labelled i586
17:11:19 <itchka> Pharaoh_Atem: any news on dnf?
17:13:26 <Pharaoh_Atem> itchka: not at this time
17:14:22 <Pharaoh_Atem> I'm working on preparing prototype packages
17:15:55 <itchka> Ok Thanks :)
17:16:18 <itchka> lets move on.
17:16:29 <itchka> #item  4
17:17:06 <itchka> #topic  ABF progress on "build chains"
17:18:04 <itchka> fedya: HisShadow anything to report on this (I hope I have the name right)..
17:19:00 <itchka> Life would be so much easier if this were done.
17:19:34 <itchka> Is there a repo for it? Has a start been made?
17:22:57 * ben79 itchka: Do we know that latest i586 (# 994) in ABF doesn't work?
17:24:48 <itchka> I did not try it.. I assumed that Giorgio had and that it was broken.
17:25:31 <ben79> OK
17:25:48 <ben79> Are you refering to a bug report?
17:26:48 <itchka> He posted on the cooker list.
17:27:57 <ben79> OK, onward...
17:28:10 <ben79> build chains
17:28:31 <itchka> fedya: HisShadow: ping
18:03:06 <ben79> Item 5?
18:03:15 <ben79> Item 6?
18:05:49 <ben79> I'm not aware of graphic problems with VirtualBox 5.1.22
18:07:27 <bero|3> me neither
18:16:56 <itchka> ben79: Didn't you post about it?
18:17:49 <fedya> i'm here
18:17:59 <fedya> hissadhow busy with his job
18:18:06 <fedya> no time to solve build chains
18:18:44 <ben79> itchka: that user was booting into LIve indicating working graphics his problem was after install booting into installed system indicating something in OM not starting
18:19:03 <ben79> probably not graphics
18:19:20 <ben79> or so I *thought*
18:20:05 <ben79> FWIW: that user has been able to install and use OM Lx 3.02 ISO 993 problem was with Lx 3.01
18:20:06 <itchka> Ah ok ben79 no problem there then and now kernel-4.11 is in the repos all should be ok
18:20:27 <ben79> 4.11 works here on Intel junk
18:20:34 <itchka> He probably installed with autologin.
18:20:55 <ben79> perhaps and likely
18:21:11 <itchka> I don't know whether jaro tried it but it workd for me on nVidia.
18:22:59 <itchka> fedya: Sad..I don't know how we are going to sort the problem out. I will explore other ways. If I find someone would you and HisShadow give him guidence at the beginning?
18:24:21 <ben79> jaro is using some other Linux distro, another potential user lost
18:25:11 <fedya> i think yes
18:25:22 <ben79> there is a user in Bangladesh, tantrik, having problems connectiong to internet:
18:25:25 <ben79> https://forum.openmandriva.org/t/cannot-connect-to-internet-in-openmandiva-lx-3-01/1086
18:25:49 <ben79> unless she/he has given up also, this is frustrating
18:26:16 <itchka> I looked at that ben79 but I couldn't make head nor tail of it..
18:26:52 <ben79> we're losing potential users and in the bacvk of my mind I worry about the first thing not tech savvy users see after installing OM Lx 3.02:
18:26:52 <ben79> Error: Sparse file not allowed
18:27:00 <ben79> that's just wonderful
18:27:00 <itchka> It sounded like he was trying to set up OMA as a router..
18:27:25 <ben79> the intenet problem in Bangladesh may also be over our heads collectively
18:28:08 <ben79> No just trying to use OMA like he or she does other Linux distros
18:28:26 <itchka> It's not a real error it's a consequence of the f2fs patches to grub2. Maybe there's some way to filter it.
18:29:01 <ben79> itchka: I know it's not a real error but it is horrible public relations all users don't know what you or I know
18:29:17 <ben79> terrible, horrible, gastly bad
18:29:44 <ben79> People will and have seen that and immediatly quit
18:30:04 <ben79> We can't release Lx 3.02 with that
18:30:20 <ben79> and the easy answer is?
18:30:25 <itchka> bero|3: Is there any way you could hack that out. Perhaps we just disable that bit of grub2...
18:30:37 <fedya> ‎itchka‎ as router it's not a hard task
18:30:40 <ben79> use ext4 by default
18:31:03 <itchka> ben79. I'm not sure that would work.
18:31:26 <ben79> why on earth can we not use ext4 as default fs?
18:31:32 <itchka> fedya: Maybe you could take a look at the problem.
18:32:41 <ben79> f2fs is for SSD's it is not well suited to conventional mechinical drives
18:32:59 <ben79> plus f2fs is toxic on Linux multi-boot systems
18:33:16 <itchka> ben79: There's no reason except that the presemce of the patches may be enough to trigger the error so switching to ext4 may not fix it.
18:33:53 <ben79> itchka: I install systems right now with ext4 that do not have that error message
18:34:03 <itchka> ben79: I don't disagree with you. I am very distyrustful of f2fs
18:34:38 <ben79> it should not be default but we should publicize the availability for those who are interested.
18:35:11 <ben79> Again f2fs today is not compatiable with multi-boot Linux. I know what I'm talking about here.
18:36:28 <itchka> ben79: Then write to the cooker ml and I'll back you. I haven't tested as my main drives are ssd but I'm not that happy with f2fs
18:36:39 <ben79> f2fs is OK for use on Desktop computers with SSD's but it is primarily for smartphones, android stuff
18:36:45 <itchka> Put forward a case from you experience.
18:36:55 <itchka> you=your
18:38:20 <ben79> OK, I'll need to gather some documentation so may take a few days, I want my ducks in a row for this
18:39:01 <itchka> Good and thank you.
18:40:12 * ben79 the other problem being that I currently don't get Cooker ML e-mails something has gotten constipated
18:40:57 * ben79 there may be a problem with OM-QA-alerts also but not sure about that yet
18:43:16 <ben79> Here's a bug I'd personally like to get fixed: https://issues.openmandriva.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2122
18:43:45 <ben79> and: https://issues.openmandriva.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2121
18:45:26 <ben79> itchka: i586 ISO # 994 will boot into Live in VBox will try installing it and the one you did sooner or later...
18:48:27 <ben79> Don't know if bug 2121 is an easy fix but I've had people try OMLx 3.02 and if they use wifi they can't see the NetworkManager icon
18:48:53 <ben79> these are people locally that use Linux, they were looking for NetworkManager icon
18:51:57 <ben79> Latest system-config-printer doesn't seem to work without system-config-printer-gui which was installed when updating
18:52:30 <ben79> The feature in OM_Welcome and elsewhere that adds 32 bit repos is adding Cooker repos, that's a big problem
18:53:10 <ben79> That feature doesn't seem to be needed anymore anyway and I think could/should be removed
18:54:22 <ben79> On the positive side there have been a lot of issues fixed recently, thanks to bero, crisb, and TPG and probably others, if I left anyone out apologies
18:54:33 <ben79> a lot of issues fixed...
18:54:54 <ben79> which will make for a much stronger release
18:55:38 <ben79> kdenlive starts but complains of missing ffplay
18:55:54 <ben79> somebodies been doing some testing...
18:56:53 <ben79> OM-Welcome still has some issues but is overall in much better shape
18:57:39 <ben79> that's what I have on current Lx 3.02 (ISO 993) testing list
18:58:34 <ben79> except for bug reports which I haven't gone through for a week so that needs updating there are more needing fixing than what is mentioned above
18:58:46 <ben79> that I do know
18:59:51 <ben79> excuse me correction: Latest system-config-printer doesn't seem to work without system-config-printer-gui which was NOT installed when updating
19:01:12 <ben79> oh and itchka also has helped with solving issues along with those mentioned above
19:02:15 <fedya> problem with f2fs?
19:03:06 <ben79> there's not a problem I'm just concinced it should not be our default fs, it's for SSD's not so well suited for mechinical drives
19:03:22 <ben79> and is useless on Linux multi-boot systems
19:03:49 <bero|3> Also grub's support for f2fs isn't very mature
19:04:12 <bero|3> So it's far more likely to break...
19:05:21 <ben79> For instance: if one does multi-boot and installs OMA with f2fs on other LInus systems not only is OMA not recognized os-prober won't proble any other systems, that's not good
19:05:35 <ben79> Linus=Linux
19:07:50 <ben79> correction:  if one does multi-boot and installs OMA with f2fs other LInux systems will not recognize OMA but worse  os-prober won't probe any other systems, that's not good
19:08:21 <ben79> when os-prober sees f2fs it quits in other words
19:12:21 <ben79> not to mention when non-technical users install OM Lx 3.02 the first thing they will see is:
19:12:31 <ben79> Error: Sparse file not allowed
19:12:54 <ben79> To you and I that's not a big deal but to some potential users it's frightening
19:44:52 <ben79> Hmmm...
19:59:25 <itchka> We should ideally change the default to ext4 since f2fs breaks multi-boot.
20:00:11 <itchka> At some point we are going to have to look at secure boot.
20:01:39 <ben79> Yeah, some distros have it now like openSUSE
20:02:37 <ben79> FWIW I'm "against" f2fs I just see to many problems with it as a default fs.
20:03:24 <ben79> I am going to be adamant about releasing something that has an error message as nearly the first thing new users see, that's a no go here
20:04:47 <ben79> for those of us that try to help users on the Forum it has already caused endless headaches
20:05:09 <ben79> and that's just with a handful of users...
20:06:34 <ben79> If that error is on a public release I'll disappear in a South Louisiana swamp for a while
20:11:41 <itchka> As I said ben79 write to cooker ml.
20:12:50 <ben79> And as I said, I will, but it may take a few days
20:13:25 <ben79> Is anyone else getting Cooker ML's today? I've sent at least 6 that have disappeared...
20:14:29 <christann> Hi Ben, When you send a message to the Cooker ML, it is not sent to you but is sent to everybody else on the ML. I presume that this setting can be changed.
20:17:04 <bero|3> ben79: Be careful about that South Luisiana swamp... Remember Trump promised to "drain the swamp"? ;)
20:17:38 <christann> Don't people who live in these swamps speak French?
20:18:10 <jbj> Cajun but yes
20:18:23 <ben79> bero|3: Yeah my buddy who's looking out for "people like me"
20:18:56 <bero|3> He's far more likely to drain THAT swamp than the swamp his supporters think he was talking about
20:19:29 <ben79> christann: jbj is correct, today maybe 150,000 Louisiana folks speak Cajun French as 1st language a generation or 2 ago it was maybe 1 and 1/2 million.
20:19:50 <christann> There are may swamps in Ottawa, but fortunately (I think) the parliament buildings are far above the floods.
20:20:03 <ben79> When I grew up there were schools that were English in the classroom and french in the hallway
20:20:19 <ben79> french=French woops!
20:20:43 <christann> Sounds like a school that my wife's granddaughter went to, but the other way around. French in the classroom and English everywhere else.
20:21:17 <ben79> here we're still debating things like earth: flat or round and evolution
20:21:39 <ben79> 'mericans are real funny in our relationship to science
20:21:51 <christann> Yes - How can evolution (a la Darwin) arrive at something like Trump.
20:22:26 <ben79> With Trump I try to focus on the humor of which there is a lot
20:26:06 <ben79> baseball analogy may not work with this crowd but Trump is one of those guys who was born on 3rd base and thinks he hit a triple.,.
20:26:25 <christann> That is lovely.
20:26:43 <ben79> fits doesn't it?
20:28:01 <christann> Meeting still on?
20:28:19 <ben79> FWIW: was once part of France and then Spain, the Spanish did most of the building in the New Orleans French Quarter
20:29:33 <christann> We spent 2 weeks in Louisiana 2 weeks ago and loved it very much.
20:29:35 <ben79> So New Orleans and Louisana was founded by Frenchmen but the Cajun (Acadian) French are different and came from Canada
20:30:34 <christann> And Cajun French is different from Quebec French which is slightly different from French of other provinces.
20:30:45 <ben79> So in New Orleans we talked abut people as Parisian French or Cajun French
20:33:47 <ben79> The Acadian culture in S. Louisiana is fascinating especially along side the Creole culture
20:34:37 <ben79> Antoine's in New Orleans is the oldes continuously operating haute cuisine restuarant in the Western Hemisphere
20:35:01 <ben79> I believe the nest oldest in in Mexico City
20:44:27 <ben79> Crap, looks like OM-QA alerts isn't working either here
20:44:55 * ben79 I gotta go do some physical exercise
20:46:43 <fedya> what it is Cajun?
20:48:23 <christann> Cajun is a corruption of Acadian. The first French settlers in North America went to Nova Scotia (a province in Eastern Canada). When the British took over, eventually they kicked these French out
20:48:49 <christann> and a number of them moved to Louisiana which was still in French hands then.
20:50:02 <christann> As well as Louisiana, you can hear Cajun/Acadian French in parts of Nova Scotia & New Brunswick (Canadian provinces).
20:50:39 <ben79> when the French and British had the Seven Years War around 1756-1763
21:00:34 <itchka> I guess it's time I closed the meeting
21:00:49 <itchka> Thanks everyone
21:00:51 <itchka> #endmeetin
21:00:54 <itchka> #endmeeting