[15:24:25] Meeting started by ben79 [15:24:26] .confused [15:24:53] itchka: https://sopel.chat/usage/commands/ [15:25:39] .success [15:26:06] .comment Might want to bookmark that page [15:26:09] Meeting chairs are: itchka, ben79, ruru[m] [15:26:27] thinks agenda item 1 covered. [15:26:40] .now_we_are_in_business [15:26:56] .happy [15:27:22] .t [15:27:49] But he still won't bark [15:28:45] .t [15:29:05] .bark bero [15:29:30] that t basically means: time flies.. [15:30:59] I suppose we need an agenda, realizing that the only dev here seems to be fdrt. [15:31:07] Lets start... We have no bero so there's mpt much we can do about 4.2 I am running rolling and it's by no means perfect. [15:31:43] Must go for a minute will be back soon. I have a caller [15:33:22] I am running cooker. Things seem to be working okay, but Windows 10 on VBOX hangs with both the gcc and clang kernels. [15:34:35] That's not so good; have you tried the non-free version? [15:36:01] hi [15:36:46] I am running OMV version. I will try the non-free version. [15:36:59] as for me, cooker is in mixed condition [15:37:03] .d [15:37:17] One thing in rolling that is really annoying is that Okular crashes every time when you open a pdf from dolphin but if you try the same file a second time it works.... [15:37:35] Can vbox be updated to vs. 6.1.14? [15:37:51] Okular crashes in cooker as well! [15:38:46] I see at least few bugs that I observe on two computers [15:38:58] and yes, okular crashes here too [15:39:22] here okular crashes if you click on a .pdf file but if you open from context menu it does open. So the bug may be with [15:39:29] Chromium is also dodgy crashing sometimes even on gmail and gdrive pages. [15:39:59] There seems to be a general problem with things starting in Plasma desktop. IMO. [15:40:20] btw. anyone know why some packages are locked on github? I can't make pull req for example for networkmanager [15:41:09] Search is also broken in Okular if I remember rightly. To be honest Okular is a bit rubbish compared to Evince which I now use as a substitute. [15:41:33] systemd-coredump[11342]: Process 11235 (okular) of user 1001 dumped core. [15:42:33] Evince: Horrors! Gasp! >>> It is designed for the GNOME desktop environment. [15:43:52] I know, but try it and you'll see what I mean. The undelying code may be crap but GUI does all sorts of things that Okular doesn't do. [15:44:32] still do determine if okular upstream bug or OM bug [15:45:07] bero sort of half fixed it but the problem returned. [15:45:15] Well code purity aside if we limit our distro to Qt only the we do limit our ability to have best software from user perspective. [15:46:22] itchka: I remember bero fixed different bug, when it did not crash everytime yet [15:46:23] Okular has always seemed to be a weak replacement for Adobe Reader. [15:47:37] Much as I hate to say it I think Evince should be the default. [15:47:49] 'Nuther problem with plasma 5.20 is this: https://imgur.com/a/7bJkX7C [15:48:24] That is actually Application Menu not Application Launcher as they are listed in English. [15:49:17] Not sure what you mean ben79? [15:49:39] Does that look like the normal Application Menu? [15:50:14] That happened with plasma 5.20 release you don't have that in Rolling yet. [15:50:48] I don't know I always set up with the full screen launcher since the application menu is too finicky in terms of mouse over. [15:51:05] If I add only the icons I want they will all be there twice. Weird. [15:52:16] ben79: maybe related to 'I know what you need to be in the panel' ? [15:52:25] There's a list of recent applications and then your list of icons [15:52:25] The application dashboard isn't working well here. Top two rows of "favorites" are duplicated. Since last update of plasma. [15:53:20] If you look around the word utilities you can see the dicider. [15:53:27] divider [15:53:28] It seems that some parts of plasma have been updated to 5.20.0 and some are still at 5.19.90. [15:53:29] Yep, that is correct [15:55:38] christann: You are correct and that would explain why there is weirdness, so we should wait until all is 5.20 before bug reports if any are needed. [15:59:16] Well I guess 4.2 is now going to have to wait until 4.20 is fully built so once again the new release will be delayed. [15:59:28] sorry 5.20 [16:00:22] So in Cooker znver1 we have plasma-desktop-5.19.90-3 and plasma-workspace-5.20.0-1 so that may be problematic. [16:00:54] kde stuff rebuild did not finish [16:01:25] Probably 5.20 was a fairly major update from what i have heard. [16:01:47] PD and KF at least if I'm not wrong [16:02:19] Kapps, not KF [16:05:38] I have another hal-hour before I have to go. I would like to introduce an agenda item that may affect the way we hold these meetings. Is everybody ok with that? [16:05:47] half-hour [16:11:11] It's gone very quiet.. [16:11:24] itchka: go [16:11:29] ahead [16:11:31] :) [16:14:16] I would like to propose that we try out Zoom as our meeting method used in conjunction with irc for when we paste stuff there's a possibility it may speed thing up. My wife has a zoom account and is willing to set up the meeting for us. It can be done so anyone can host the meeting. What are your opinions? [16:16:21] I have attended a number of Zoom-type meetings recently and they do appear to work. As ruru[m] stated, the concern would be people's accents, especially those whose first language is not English. [16:17:02] yep [16:17:24] And the audio quality can be interesting at times. [16:20:08] Yes the audio quality can be a bit interesting but if you use a web cam rather than one in the laptop there seems to be less trouble with feedback. I think if the laptop volume is too loud it feeds back to the internal mike of the laptop. [16:20:46] imo it could/should be a RFC email to be sent in cooker list [16:21:52] and/or a forum topic [16:22:07] just suggesting.. [16:22:33] ruru[m]: Absolutely we would have to seek the approval of everyone..though there is noting to stop us having a trial meeting at some point to see how things run. [16:23:37] I agree with a trial meeting. [16:23:52] fwiw I'll never agree. but that's just me. [16:24:52] I have done quite a lot of zoom meetings over the last months and there does need to be some managment of the meeting to ensure things run smoothly. [16:25:55] Why is it a problem for you ruru[m]? Is it the language aspect? [16:26:06] yes [16:26:55] You seem to manage very well on irc... is it my awful accent? :) [16:26:58] unless we do them every time in a different language, so ppl can realize how much hard it can be :P [16:28:02] I do understand ruru[m] I too am very language challenged and woulr stand no chance in Italian :) [16:28:04] itchka: different is to write and to read, different is to have to listen (and understand without the help of translator maybe) and to talk. [16:29:02] so that's for sure a no-go, but mainly is for non-inclusive principle. [16:30:43] That is why I suggested to use irc and zoom together so that the main points could be typed (and any replies given). [16:31:56] I understand. I gave my opinion, nothing else to add :) [16:31:57] The purpose of the suggestion is certainly not intended to exclude anyone. [16:32:22] it looks it is, sorry [16:32:38] ofc not intentionally [16:33:25] I'm here to remind, if any need, the downside [16:35:12] I haven't seen you since Budapest ruru[m] it would be good to see you again :) [16:35:37] I wish we could :) [16:36:37] I'm afraid these are not the best times though [16:37:07] with the virus troubles [16:37:07] ruru[m]: How about we have one meeting just for fun we can all be there. We will hold the conversation on irc but at least we can all see each other and maybe have a virtual coffee afterwards. [16:37:59] sure have fun with your talk [16:38:07] Yes the virus..ot's getting worse here again the Brits are so undiciplined. [16:38:08] I won't be there. [16:38:08] My understanding of Zoom in situation where not everyone is used to spoken communication in the meeting language is that meetings take a lot longer. Lots of explaining to do. [16:40:22] Well the US seems determined to show Brits that we can be even more undisciplined! And decline as a nation even faster!!! [16:40:54] I haven't attended a meeting with multiple languages unless you count all the regiona; accets that we have in the UK. [16:41:28] I was not talking about meeting in multiple languages, I have not heard of that being done. [16:42:11] I mean if not everyone is used to spoken communication in English regardless of how well the write it. [16:43:12] It's clearly not a good idea so lets just drop it. [16:43:43] itchka: no, just drop an email in cooker list or start a forum topic [16:44:08] there are more than just our 2/4 opinions to hear [16:44:43] I don't know how to make our meetings take less time. [16:44:52] No ruru[m] it's clear that acceptance would not in anyway be unanimous and the last thing I would want to do is alienate a core member of the distro. [16:45:22] itchka: I count 1 [16:46:03] And I don't know that Zoom is not a great idea, I was just sharing what I've heard from some people I know in science fields where the regularly communicate with people all over like we do. [16:46:33] ben79: just need to discuss items in agenda and not to digress [16:46:47] ben79: We just have to be more disciplined and have headings like AIB where the agenda point is very specific and we stick to the agenda point. [16:46:50] problem solved. [16:47:29] easy to say but as soon as one person brings up a technical problem... [16:47:38] I'm sorry I have to fo and cook I am already overtime. [16:47:40] And it is Technical Committee Meeting [16:47:43] meeting time is meeting time, every chit&chat is to delay after meeting time. period. [16:48:08] see you soon itchka [16:49:01] technical problems go discussed after meeting time, when all items are covered. [16:49:03] imho. [16:49:11] Meeting on irc with strict agenda is the only way. The other stuff can take place afterwards on whatever platform people choose. [16:49:16] It is the same as any other rule we *think* we have, no enforcement. But yes sticking to the agenda and not deviating is "Efficient Meeting 101". [16:50:02] Chairpersons job. Those digressing get warned if they continue perhaps a short ban :) [16:50:16] Gotta go! [16:50:21] so the chair has to tell the 'intruders' "please wait until the meeting is over. [16:50:30] exactly [16:51:20] if ppl don't understand the chair has to tell them. [16:51:27] So we should . action ben79 to update list of reported bugs in Cooker, Rolling, and Rock/Stable. [16:52:03] Anything else we can take action on like today we start an agenda for next week? [16:52:20] So we can discuss any thorny details in this channel beforehand? [16:53:08] having an agenda before the meeting will help [16:53:14] ACTION: ben79 will for out next meeting provide updated list of reported bugs for each branch. [16:53:33] I used to send email to cooker list, IF I have the agenda :) [16:53:51] I think have an agenda beforehand and in some cases talking here about issues on agenda beforehand would do a lot to tighten things up. [16:54:03] yes [16:54:45] We need to discuss or do: 1. WTF are we doing regarding releasing Lx 4.2? (Release Never?) [16:55:07] 2. When (soon I hope) will we next cp cooker2rolling? [16:55:38] 3. We need to get developers back to involvement with bug squashing if they have time to do so. [16:56:02] ben79: I'm running rolling right now and not so eager to have it upgraded to cooker tbh :) [16:56:16] 3a. Realize people may not have time because of the world going bonkers. [16:58:42] ^^^ suggestions, not etched in stone, yet... ^^^ [17:02:46] suggestions is good, agreement is good, make anarchist ppl stick to the rules is... uhmmm.. hard :) [17:03:57] nothing new here lol [17:06:05] ACTION: Tentative agenda for next weeks (2020-10-21) TC-Meeting: [17:06:33] ACTION: 1. What and where are we regarding releasing Lx 4.2? [17:07:01] ACTION: 2. When will we next cp cooker2rolling? [17:07:13] will c/p the temp agenda to forum [17:07:52] I'm thinking if there is better way to handle # 3 but we do need to get back to at least some efforts on bug fixing if we are to release 4.2. [17:08:34] ben79: what is # 3 ? [17:09:03] ruru[m]: I forgot why you are using Rolling but I recall that is an issue that needs to be fixed for release of 4.2. [17:09:25] and why 'action' ? should not be Item 1, 2, 3 etc. ? [17:10:00] ben79: bc cooker broken without any hope :P [17:10:09] Because I get tired of waiting so I did something. [17:10:20] ok [17:10:26] .item 1. What and where are we regarding releasing Lx 4.2? [17:10:44] Don't know so I did something [17:11:10] ben79: np, just needed to understand. [17:11:38] 3. We need to get people especially developers back involved fixing reported bugs. [17:12:35] .actions QA needs someone that uses LaTex or texlive to confirm (or otherwise) this bug report: http://issues.openmandriva.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2651 [17:14:27] In retrospect doing the .action 1. ect. was not necessary could have just listed them and just did .action Tentative agenda for next weeks (2020-10-21) TC-Meeting: [17:14:43] So I'm learning as I go. Like a lot of what I do here... [17:15:12] .crazy [17:15:33] .happy [17:16:04] Ah! [17:16:59] cool [17:17:15] Ah what the heck [17:17:25] ACTION: 3. We need to get people especially developers back involved fixing reported bugs. [17:18:36] Item 3 is something we do to the extent we can and folks are able. I don't like the part where it sounds like I'm attempting to plan other peoples time. [17:19:26] So anything else? [17:20:32] angry-beer[m]: Anything on this bug report? http://issues.openmandriva.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2653 [17:21:07] ben79: I suppose out next meeting = our next meeting, right? [17:21:28] Yes, that needs correcting, thanks [17:21:38] ok, just to know :) [17:21:53] I'm copypasting items [17:24:53] I have both pages bookmarked that have the chwido/meetingbot commands. [17:27:17] https://forum.openmandriva.org/t/events-and-meetings-calendar/2735/27 [17:27:20] ? [17:31:24] Looks good to me. If we can get all that addressed in a week or two that would be some significant progress. [17:32:03] ok [17:37:26] As far as I'm concerned we can end meeting. [17:37:48] Let's hope we get more done between now and next meeting. [17:38:28] yes [17:39:33] OK, if no one has anything else we end meeting in 5 minutes? [17:47:25] Meeting ended by ben79. Total meeting length: 143 minutes